Design Board

Franconp

Frank
Hi,

First thanks for helping with the design.

Here it's the design: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1iGanTkqknNmU9SsbOcNhF8bFiqCaWXJopJxLVyb5XUc/edit?usp=sharing

As the first game this is role madness and has a map. I want to also be advertised as bastard even when it's not as bastard as the first one.

I know that it's kind of a mess. This is like the fifth design that I made. I started with a really ambitious design which I soon realized that it was too difficult to run and then started toning it down and keeping things that I liked from previous designs. So thing seems a little disconnected.

The only role that I don't want to lose it's the bomber as it was one of the things that inspired to make a second game (it's based on one of the crazy theories that several players had on the previous game). I wouldn't mind a nerf in case it's considered too op.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Opened that design doc and got to the second tab before I realized there was no way I was going to be able to review this on mobile lol I’ll check it out later tonight and get some thoughts down.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Sorry - I got busy yesterday but I'll get to it today for sure.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Random thoughts/questions:
  • Are the miller and godfather items a permanent change? How will that work if a scum player gets miller or a town player gets godfather?
  • The handcuffs item - does it just link them for deaths or do all actions targeting one affect both regardless of the action?
  • When does the Old Sign go into affect? The subsequent night?
  • Poison, antidote, motion detector, and tracker - are these all one shot items that can be used on any subsequent night?
  • Do the items circumvent the limitation on one action being performed a night?
  • For the auctions - you say a tie discards all the people with that entry. Does it then go to the next highest, non-tying player?
  • Do you keep your unspent coins from one night to the next or do you lose them?
  • You say the auctions are anonymous but held on OM. So are you thinking there's an auction thread that only you can post in but all players can see and they then PM you their bets?
  • Does the Crazy Doctor know they're crazy or do they think they're just a doctor?
  • Smith - so is it N1 starts making, N2 can send with 50% effectiveness or wait, N3 must send with 100% effectiveness? Does it then start back up at the beginning or is it one shot?
  • Deflector - You specifically mean it redirects all non-killing actions targeting the deflector, right? Just making sure.
  • Mourner - I think it might be good to just clarify you can deny questions at your discretion. People might try and be cute and tiptoe around alignment questions by saying things like "Should I vote for _______" which isn't asking alignment but indirectly is fishing for it.
  • Multiple Voter - will the extra votes be disabled at a certain point in the game?
  • Does the bomb go through BPs and doctor protects?
  • I like the negative utility of several town roles, but they feel a bit stronger than scum in my mind with the tracker, 75% doc, innocent child, smith, amnesiac cop, oracle, light sleeper, override, and multiple voter. Plus they by the nature of more people will be more likely to win more auction items.
  • One thing to keep in mind is how you'll resolve the room blocker and the roleblocker actions when they intersect.
 

Franconp

Frank
Random thoughts/questions:
  • Are the miller and godfather items a permanent change? How will that work if a scum player gets miller or a town player gets godfather?
They are permanent. If a scum player gets a miller or a town a godfather nothing happens. I was thinking of changing the item name to "horse head" so it's more obvious that it's a godfather and scum are more interested to go after it.

The handcuffs item - does it just link them for deaths or do all actions targeting one affect both regardless of the action?

All actions. The handcuffs only works for one night.

When does the Old Sign go into affect? The subsequent night?

The player can choose when to use it. It's a day command. I was thinking about having them post a command in the main thread.

Poison, antidote, motion detector, and tracker - are these all one shot items that can be used on any subsequent night?

All one shot. Can be used whenever the player wants.

Do the items circumvent the limitation on one action being performed a night?

Nope. Either their own action or the item. The only exception would be day commands.

For the auctions - you say a tie discards all the people with that entry. Does it then go to the next highest, non-tying player?

Yes. For example:

3 players: X, Y and Z. Let's say it's day one.

Player X bets 15 to bulletproof, 5 to silence and 5 to motion detector
Player Y bets 15 to bulletproof, 10 to silence and 0 to motion detector
Player Z bets 10 to bulletproof, 10 to silence and 0 to motion detector.

Both 15's bids for the bulletproof are eliminated and Z wins the item. For the silence both 10's are eliminated and X win the silence. For the motion detector X has the highest bid so he wins that too.

Do you keep your unspent coins from one night to the next or do you lose them?

They lose them.

You say the auctions are anonymous but held on OM. So are you thinking there's an auction thread that only you can post in but all players can see and they then PM you their bets?

Yes. I won't tell them who is participating in the auction or who wins each item. I won't even tell them why they were choosen to participate or where the next one will be. They have to figure it out themselves.

Does the Crazy Doctor know they're crazy or do they think they're just a doctor?

They know that they are a crazy doctor and how their role works. They won't be notified if they blocked or protected their target. Usually when a doctor protects a player and noone dies they have a semi confirmed townie. Also, if a roleblocker targets a player and noone dies they have a likely scum. I love the idea of not giving a player that info, "If I targeted a player and noone died it's because I roleblocked scum or because I protected a townie?"

Smith - so is it N1 starts making, N2 can send with 50% effectiveness or wait, N3 must send with 100% effectiveness? Does it then start back up at the beginning or is it one shot?

N1 he selects the item he wants. N2 he will have a command to send the item but with less effectiveness or to keep it. N3 he must send the item at full power. N4 all this start over again. I think this role could be OP so it takes a while to send every item.

Deflector - You specifically mean it redirects all non-killing actions targeting the deflector, right? Just making sure.

Yes.

Mourner - I think it might be good to just clarify you can deny questions at your discretion. People might try and be cute and tiptoe around alignment questions by saying things like "Should I vote for _______" which isn't asking alignment but indirectly is fishing for it.

I forgot to add that to the spreadsheet but yes, I have to approve the questions. It's also a day command so they must send their question during the day phase.

Multiple Voter - will the extra votes be disabled at a certain point in the game?

Originally, no. But now I'm thinking that I could make them stack if he don't use them. Let's say that he gets it right the first night. He could use a double vote D2 or he could keep it. If he use it he is back to one vote. If he keeps it and get it right another time he has a triple vote. After he uses that he goes back to 1 vote. Which do you think it's best?

Does the bomb go through BPs and doctor protects?

Yes. Also if the bomber is in the same room when the bomb explode he dies too and he loses the game even if he killed 5 or more players.

I like the negative utility of several town roles, but they feel a bit stronger than scum in my mind with the tracker, 75% doc, innocent child, smith, amnesiac cop, oracle, light sleeper, override, and multiple voter. Plus they by the nature of more people will be more likely to win more auction items.

And what would be best: nerf town or boost scum? Maybe adding another scum or one less townie?

One thing to keep in mind is how you'll resolve the room blocker and the roleblocker actions when they intersect.

I think that the room blocker should have higher priority as it's a one shot ability. I'm thinking that maybe I can make it a day ability and when the night starts tell the players that the room is locked and that the players outside the room can't interact with the players inside the room. Also if there is scum or one member of the gossip chat I can take their posting rights away and they can't communicate during the night. I think that could work with the right flavour.

 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
They are permanent. If a scum player gets a miller or a town a godfather nothing happens. I was thinking of changing the item name to "horse head" so it's more obvious that it's a godfather and scum are more interested to go after it.
Got it, that makes sense.

The player can choose when to use it. It's a day command. I was thinking about having them post a command in the main thread.
Having it be a day command in the thread could be fun.

Nope. Either their own action or the item. The only exception would be day commands.
That makes things a bit more reasonable at least.

They know that they are a crazy doctor and how their role works. They won't be notified if they blocked or protected their target. Usually when a doctor protects a player and noone dies they have a semi confirmed townie. Also, if a roleblocker targets a player and noone dies they have a likely scum. I love the idea of not giving a player that info, "If I targeted a player and noone died it's because I roleblocked scum or because I protected a townie?"
I do really like this role, makes for fun mindgames.

Originally, no. But now I'm thinking that I could make them stack if he don't use them. Let's say that he gets it right the first night. He could use a double vote D2 or he could keep it. If he use it he is back to one vote. If he keeps it and get it right another time he has a triple vote. After he uses that he goes back to 1 vote. Which do you think it's best?
I think making it a single use would be a good thing as opposed to continually growing. I could even see it cut to just strictly double. Generally this role is one that could be tweaked to weaken town without completely cutting something.

And what would be best: nerf town or boost scum? Maybe adding another scum or one less townie?
I don't think it's far enough off to need to add an additional scum. I think tweaking some town roles, at most cutting one town player, and maybe buffing one of the scum roles. Some options I could see would be making the smith purely a gunsmith (keeps town from getting even more protection and a vig shot can self-harm instead of purely punishing scum). Can amnesiac cop results go to scum? That's another small tweak. Maybe making the tracker limited x-shot. As for scum roles that I could see tweaked really any of them except the Strong Ninja and Roleblocker. All the others are very situational. The Framer has three attempts to pick the exact player the amnesiac cop is also picking that same night all for the result to get sent to a third party anyways. and if the cop is gone early this role just sorta twiddles its thumbs. Actress is a cool idea, but in a bastard game won't be as likely to trip someone up - maybe useful if town towns things up, but hard to say. Bartender is the best of the three, but still has to hit a player actually using a night action and hope what is being randomized doesn't accidentally screw over scum (which all told I don't think is super likely, but having to hunt out an actual player using a targeted night action is harder with only six remotely valid targets pre-auction items and some of them not even being useful for scum to randomize). If you end up cutting a town player I would suggest the adrenaline junkie perhaps, but I don't know that cutting a role is necessary yet. At least let Geno weigh in first before going the more drastic route.


I think that the room blocker should have higher priority as it's a one shot ability. I'm thinking that maybe I can make it a day ability and when the night starts tell the players that the room is locked and that the players outside the room can't interact with the players inside the room. Also if there is scum or one member of the gossip chat I can take their posting rights away and they can't communicate during the night. I think that could work with the right flavour.
Hmm, I could go either way on informing the players they can only target within the room or not. Think that one is up to you ultimately on what feels better for your vision.
 

Franconp

Frank
I think making it a single use would be a good thing as opposed to continually growing. I could even see it cut to just strictly double. Generally this role is one that could be tweaked to weaken town without completely cutting something.

So the player would get a double vote everytime he wins a bet?

Some options I could see would be making the smith purely a gunsmith (keeps town from getting even more protection and a vig shot can self-harm instead of purely punishing scum).

I can do this. Should he still give 50% weapons the first day and 100% the next one?

Can amnesiac cop results go to scum?

Yes, they can.

Maybe making the tracker limited x-shot

I can do this too. What would be a good number? 3?

The Framer has three attempts to pick the exact player the amnesiac cop is also picking that same night all for the result to get sent to a third party anyways. and if the cop is gone early this role just sorta twiddles its thumbs.

You are right and it's kind of a wasted role. Maybe I should change it. I will think about something.

Actress is a cool idea, but in a bastard game won't be as likely to trip someone up - maybe useful if town towns things up, but hard to say.

I thought of the Actress as a sort of role cop too. Scum will know who the Actress targeted so when they die they will know what role that player has. Also it could be interesting if players go after a mass claim.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
So the player would get a double vote everytime he wins a bet?
If I read the original role correctly (in that they could use the multivote numerous times) then sure, at least then it can't grow to a triple vote. If you were saying the vote only grows and can be used once then it goes back to single forever then that's different.


I can do this. Should he still give 50% weapons the first day and 100% the next one?
Yeah, I think you keep the cadence the same which could be done by saying something like N1 you start work, N2 you can deliver a 50% gun, N3 you can deliver a 100% gun, and that it only starts the loop back after delivery of the gun (that way if they're blocked or something they have their timer delayed).


Yes, they can.
Okay good, I like the idea of that even if it's a smaller chance of happening.


I can do this too. What would be a good number? 3?
That sounds good to me.


You are right and it's kind of a wasted role. Maybe I should change it. I will think about something.
Yeah, this is the one I would think is the best candidate to give scum a buff.

I thought of the Actress as a sort of role cop too. Scum will know who the Actress targeted so when they die they will know what role that player has. Also it could be interesting if players go after a mass claim.
Ah, that's a good point I hadn't considered that!
 
Cool design, I like the auction idea.
To echo Natiko I do think town is a bit more powerful right now.

Town:
Bomb Defuser - I like this one, a counter to the Bomber is needed.
Tracker - Making them X Shot is a good idea, I'd say 2 or 3.
Adrenaline Junkie - Fine with this one.
Crazy Doctor - I like that it can hurt town, personally I'd make it 70-30 chance.
Neighborizer - Fine with this one as well.
Smith - I like the changes proposed, can they target the same player for the 50% and the 100% or does it have to be 2 different ones?
Innocent Child - Fine with the role but dislike the gif part, I don't like roles that change the posting rules. Feels like a thing just there for some laughs since the person will tell them beforehand they will only be able to post gifs.
Ghost - Does this affect killing? If not then the role is good.
Hunter - I don't like the rng aspect of it, would prefer them being able to choose who they kill, what happens if they are overriden?
Deflector - Fine with this one.
Amnesiac Cop - Fine with this one.
Oracle - Fine with this one.
Mourner - Can they ask a question like, say scum posts "I'm town cop", can the Mourner ask spec if that post is a lie or not? This role might be a bit op.
Room Redirector - Fine with this one
Double Lyncher - I like this one.
Room Blocker - Blocks kills?
Light Sleeper - I don't know if town needs more information roles tbh, would maybe cut this one.
Overrider - Their vote counts as 1 of the 2?
Multiple Voter - I like the proposed changes, although I would suggest disabling it on Mylo

Scum:
Roleblocker - Fine with this one
Bartender - Maybe buff to 4 shots?
Strong Ninja - I'd say for 1 or 2 shots let them combine the 2.
Actress - I love roles like this one.
Framer - Seems weak compared to the others, especially since the only cop is the amnesiac one which isn't that good.

3rd Party:
Bomber - I'd say maybe remove the fact that they can both arm and plant at the same time.
Protector - I don't like this one, seems very weak, the chances of that player surviving are slim especially since they have to choose N0. Would suggest changing this role completely.

Edit:
Question about the poison, how many nights does it take to kill?
 

Franconp

Frank
Crazy Doctor - I like that it can hurt town, personally I'd make it 70-30 chance.

I don't mind changing it.

Smith - I like the changes proposed, can they target the same player for the 50% and the 100% or does it have to be 2 different ones?

They can either give the weapon at 50% or at 100%, not both. It works like this: N1 start with the gun, N2 he can either send it at 50% or keep it. N3 if he kept it the weapon is not at 100% and he must send it to someone else. If he sent the weapon N2 at N3 he starts working again in a new weapon.

Innocent Child - Fine with the role but dislike the gif part, I don't like roles that change the posting rules. Feels like a thing just there for some laughs since the person will tell them beforehand they will only be able to post gifs.

The gif part is there so the player has some incentive for not using his role. If the player is in trouble he can try to get out of trouble by himself or he could just use his role and be a confirmed townie but if he takes the easy way out and use his role there are repercutions.

Ghost - Does this affect killing? If not then the role is good.

I thought that yes, but if it's too OP I can change.

Hunter - I don't like the rng aspect of it, would prefer them being able to choose who they kill, what happens if they are overriden?

Originally the player could choose who to kill but then I thought that it would be interesting if it's random as the player would have no control about the kill. So, if most of the people voting for him are townreads, would he still risk making the kill? That's why I added the condition that he can choose to kill no one if he selfs vote.

Mourner - Can they ask a question like, say scum posts "I'm town cop", can the Mourner ask spec if that post is a lie or not? This role might be a bit op.

As we discussed before I will have the final say about if the questions are OK or not. Also, I'm planning to have a spoiler free spec chat. So even if he ask if it's a lie or not the only results that he will get are what other players reading the game think and no concrete info. If he wants to ask something that has been already spoiled in the spec chat I can veto that question.

Room Blocker - Blocks kills?

He can block kills that are performed from outside the room targeting a player inside the room or viceversa. But kills of 2 players inside the room or 2 players outside the rooms are OK. If I make it a day command and players are notified as soon as the night starts about the special restrictions the scum kill shouldn't be a blocked unless scum screw up.

Overrider - Their vote counts as 1 of the 2?

No.

Multiple Voter - I like the proposed changes, although I would suggest disabling it on Mylo

Good call. I will change that.

Bartender - Maybe buff to 4 shots?

Can do.

Strong Ninja - I'd say for 1 or 2 shots let them combine the 2

Both modifiers in the same shot? I think that's OP.

Bomber - I'd say maybe remove the fact that they can both arm and plant at the same time.

I can make that change. So it would be: N1 plants, N2 arms, D3 the players are notified that a bomb has been planted (maybe something vague), N3 nothing happens, N4 the bomb explodes.

In that case the bomb defuser can disarm the bomb only if it has been armed (or the same night that it's armed). Would that be OK?

Protector - I don't like this one, seems very weak, the chances of that player surviving are slim especially since they have to choose N0. Would suggest changing this role completely.

I had a similar role in Arkham and the players survived and won the game (and Natiko was one of them). In that case they had to survive until the last 5 players but they didn't had a bulletproof. In this case the protected player has 3 lifes to reach endgame. I will think of something else, maybe I can find something more interesting.

Question about the poison, how many nights does it take to kill?

After the poison has been used the player will be notified by PM that they have been poisoned. The player will die during the next night but the antidote will take place before that the kill. So if the player holding the antidote targets the poisoned player that night he don't die.


Would changing the framer for a thief work? He would be able to steal the auction items and the guns given by the smith.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
I don't mind changing it.



They can either give the weapon at 50% or at 100%, not both. It works like this: N1 start with the gun, N2 he can either send it at 50% or keep it. N3 if he kept it the weapon is not at 100% and he must send it to someone else. If he sent the weapon N2 at N3 he starts working again in a new weapon.



The gif part is there so the player has some incentive for not using his role. If the player is in trouble he can try to get out of trouble by himself or he could just use his role and be a confirmed townie but if he takes the easy way out and use his role there are repercutions.



I thought that yes, but if it's too OP I can change.



Originally the player could choose who to kill but then I thought that it would be interesting if it's random as the player would have no control about the kill. So, if most of the people voting for him are townreads, would he still risk making the kill? That's why I added the condition that he can choose to kill no one if he selfs vote.



As we discussed before I will have the final say about if the questions are OK or not. Also, I'm planning to have a spoiler free spec chat. So even if he ask if it's a lie or not the only results that he will get are what other players reading the game think and no concrete info. If he wants to ask something that has been already spoiled in the spec chat I can veto that question.



He can block kills that are performed from outside the room targeting a player inside the room or viceversa. But kills of 2 players inside the room or 2 players outside the rooms are OK. If I make it a day command and players are notified as soon as the night starts about the special restrictions the scum kill shouldn't be a blocked unless scum screw up.



No.



Good call. I will change that.



Can do.



Both modifiers in the same shot? I think that's OP.



I can make that change. So it would be: N1 plants, N2 arms, D3 the players are notified that a bomb has been planted (maybe something vague), N3 nothing happens, N4 the bomb explodes.

In that case the bomb defuser can disarm the bomb only if it has been armed (or the same night that it's armed). Would that be OK?



I had a similar role in Arkham and the players survived and won the game (and Natiko was one of them). In that case they had to survive until the last 5 players but they didn't had a bulletproof. In this case the protected player has 3 lifes to reach endgame. I will think of something else, maybe I can find something more interesting.



After the poison has been used the player will be notified by PM that they have been poisoned. The player will die during the next night but the antidote will take place before that the kill. So if the player holding the antidote targets the poisoned player that night he don't die.


Would changing the framer for a thief work? He would be able to steal the auction items and the guns given by the smith.
And the Bomber wouldn’t be able to set another bomb until the first one is resolved? That seems too slow. Odds are if a bomb ever got defused they just lose.

Thief could be okay but I question how many of the items won’t just be used before they could be stolen? Most players aren’t that patient. The new scum role could maybe interact with the auctions though. Maybe they either innately have more coins to use (even 1 extra would be a big advantage), they could reduce the coins of others, or maybe if they end up in an auction they get to pick one item to steal of their choice (similar to the extra coins in practice but a little less interactive). Oh, or it could be like a 1-shot find out where the auction will be the next night and then scum get to choose how much they stack for them.
 
They can either give the weapon at 50% or at 100%, not both. It works like this: N1 start with the gun, N2 he can either send it at 50% or keep it. N3 if he kept it the weapon is not at 100% and he must send it to someone else. If he sent the weapon N2 at N3 he starts working again in a new weapon.
No I mean, if they try the 50% on player X, can they send it next night with the 100% on player X again?
The gif part is there so the player has some incentive for not using his role. If the player is in trouble he can try to get out of trouble by himself or he could just use his role and be a confirmed townie but if he takes the easy way out and use his role there are repercutions.
That's fair but still I'd prefer something like "you can make X posts per day" than the gif gimmick, I don't mind it but it could be frustrating to other players if they start spamming gifs, eat up other players' data etc.
I thought that yes, but if it's too OP I can change.
Yeah I think it shouldn't count on kills, would fuck up the mafia way too hard.
As we discussed before I will have the final say about if the questions are OK or not. Also, I'm planning to have a spoiler free spec chat. So even if he ask if it's a lie or not the only results that he will get are what other players reading the game think and no concrete info. If he wants to ask something that has been already spoiled in the spec chat I can veto that question.
If the chat is spoiler free then everything changes, the role is fine then.
He can block kills that are performed from outside the room targeting a player inside the room or viceversa. But kills of 2 players inside the room or 2 players outside the rooms are OK. If I make it a day command and players are notified as soon as the night starts about the special restrictions the scum kill shouldn't be a blocked unless scum screw up.
I don't know, even as a 1 shot it almost guarantees the kill will be blocked, it's like a mass doc for a single night. I would be ok with it if it didn't block kills. On the other hand if you notify everyone then it's kind of a useless role right?
Both modifiers in the same shot? I think that's OP.
Just proposed the change to buff scum a bit. It's not too OP if it's 1 shot for example.
I can make that change. So it would be: N1 plants, N2 arms, D3 the players are notified that a bomb has been planted (maybe something vague), N3 nothing happens, N4 the bomb explodes.

In that case the bomb defuser can disarm the bomb only if it has been armed (or the same night that it's armed). Would that be OK?
I actually messed up when reading, I thought he could plant a bomb the same night it explodes, keep it as is then.

Rereading I want to say I kind of don't like the revive, I think it's way too much power for anyone who takes it, scum revives a dead scum and they have to waste a lynch on that person and town revives a strong pr and scum has to waste a kill on them. There's not a lot of extra kills in this game so scum would be kind of screwed.
 

Franconp

Frank
Oh, or it could be like a 1-shot find out where the auction will be the next night and then scum get to choose how much they stack for them.

I like this one. Or maybe he can participate in any auction no matter where he spend the night.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
@Geno I don’t think it means give the weapon with a 50% chance they receive it. It’s give a weapon that only has a 50% chance of working when said player tries to use it.
 

Franconp

Frank
No I mean, if they try the 50% on player X, can they send it next night with the 100% on player X again?

They give a gun, they doesn't make the kill. They just make the gun and gives it to another player who then makes the kill.

I didn't add to the spreadsheet that the player who receives a gun at 50% won't know that the gun can fail.

That's fair but still I'd prefer something like "you can make X posts per day" than the gif gimmick, I don't mind it but it could be frustrating to other players if they start spamming gifs, eat up other players' data etc.

I don't like the idea about limiting the amount of posts a player can do during the game. I also don't like the idea of treestumping them. I will think of another restriction.

I don't know, even as a 1 shot it almost guarantees the kill will be blocked, it's like a mass doc for a single night. I would be ok with it if it didn't block kills. On the other hand if you notify everyone then it's kind of a useless role right?

It works like how the missions worked in Archer Mafia (season 3). An example about how it would work:

D3 player X uses the role and spend the night at the library. When the night start I will tell players that everyone outside the room can target players inside the room and players inside the room can't target players outside the room.

Then all players who are inside the library can only target between themselves and all players who are outside the library can only target between themselves.

So if scum wants to kill a player who is inside the library they need to have a player spending the night there. If there is no scum player inside the library they can target any player who didn't spend the night at the library.

It doesn't work as a mass doctor as it just separate the players into 2 groups who can interact only between themselves during that night phase.

Just proposed the change to buff scum a bit. It's not too OP if it's 1 shot for example.

If it's for 1 shot I think it's ok.

Rereading I want to say I kind of don't like the revive, I think it's way too much power for anyone who takes it, scum revives a dead scum and they have to waste a lynch on that person and town revives a strong pr and scum has to waste a kill on them. There's not a lot of extra kills in this game so scum would be kind of screwed.

The revive doesn't work as it did in HvV. The player who receive the revive can only the player who died that same night phase. If the player use the role and someone died that night the kill is prevented. The player won't know who did he save. If more than one player would died that night the revive would be random. If noone was dying that night the shot is lost. As it's a night action it doesn't works on lynchs.
 
The revive doesn't work as it did in HvV. The player who receive the revive can only the player who died that same night phase. If the player use the role and someone died that night the kill is prevented. The player won't know who did he save. If more than one player would died that night the revive would be random. If noone was dying that night the shot is lost. As it's a night action it doesn't works on lynchs.
Ah ok I understand, it's fine then.
It works like how the missions worked in Archer Mafia (season 3). An example about how it would work:

D3 player X uses the role and spend the night at the library. When the night start I will tell players that everyone outside the room can target players inside the room and players inside the room can't target players outside the room.

Then all players who are inside the library can only target between themselves and all players who are outside the library can only target between themselves.

So if scum wants to kill a player who is inside the library they need to have a player spending the night there. If there is no scum player inside the library they can target any player who didn't spend the night at the library.

It doesn't work as a mass doctor as it just separate the players into 2 groups who can interact only between themselves during that night phase.
Alright I guess.
They just make the gun and gives it to another player who then makes the kill.

I didn't add to the spreadsheet that the player who receives a gun at 50% won't know that the gun can fail.
I thought it was what Natiko said, my bad.
 

Franconp

Frank
I made a roleV2 where I added some of the changes that we discussed.

I changed the Framer and gave scum an Auction Fanatic, who will participate in every auction no matter in which room they spend the night. That way scum will have a player participating in every auction, have a chance of winning items every night or at least will know what items were auctioned.

I also changed the innocent child and now, if they use the role, can only post using hashtags (top 4 for post, not counting votes).

Multiple Voter - I like the proposed changes, although I would suggest disabling it on Mylo

After some consideration I think it wouldn't be a good idea disabling it on Mylo. If I disable the role in Mylo that player will have a hint that they are in Mylo and will know how many scum are left. I don't like that.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
I guess I can live with double vote remaining active in mylo/lylo. I do have a few more notes though:
  • After thinking about Geno's feedback and looking at the design more I think Protector needs to be scrapped. I don't think the role is as potentially unwinnable as Geno, but I think there are some really bad scenarios. If said player picks scum then town almost has an entire extra scum player to handle since he will absorb any kill attempts on the other at first. If said player picks the override or innocent child then scum suddenly have a confirmed town that takes a bunch of extra work to remove.
  • I think the innocent child should be a combo of what it was before and now - maybe let them post in hashtags and gifs? Just an idea - the hashtag thing may get out of hand if that's all they can do and it would be very annoying to read
  • Perhaps there should be a capacity limit on the rooms...? Not so much that people are forced into every room, but enough so that everyone can't pile into one room. Just thinking that the game might just be unwinnable for the bomber assuming smart play. If the bomb defuser claims town nor scum ever want to remove them before the bomber is dead. With that in mind the players can just pile in one room on explosion night and always be safe.
  • Scum are closer, but I still think they're a tad weak compared to how many self-confirming/investigative roles town has. Potential ideas might be to limit how many guns can be handed out, add the godfather role to one of the scum (without removing their current role), or making the bartender a full on switcher/redirector (less RNG makes the role stronger - could adjust shots if desired). I'm sure there's plenty of other small tweaks that could be done, just tossing out a couple.
 

Franconp

Frank
After thinking about Geno's feedback and looking at the design more I think Protector needs to be scrapped. I don't think the role is as potentially unwinnable as Geno, but I think there are some really bad scenarios. If said player picks scum then town almost has an entire extra scum player to handle since he will absorb any kill attempts on the other at first. If said player picks the override or innocent child then scum suddenly have a confirmed town that takes a bunch of extra work to remove.

I will look for another role. I want to do something related to the rooms. Maybe a role where he can add modifiers to a room and have to affect a number of players to win?

I think the innocent child should be a combo of what it was before and now - maybe let them post in hashtags and gifs? Just an idea - the hashtag thing may get out of hand if that's all they can do and it would be very annoying to read

I could limit their post to 2 gifs and 2 hastags per post.

Perhaps there should be a capacity limit on the rooms...? Not so much that people are forced into every room, but enough so that everyone can't pile into one room. Just thinking that the game might just be unwinnable for the bomber assuming smart play. If the bomb defuser claims town nor scum ever want to remove them before the bomber is dead. With that in mind the players can just pile in one room on explosion night and always be safe.

I thought about that and it's unlikely that the bomber would claim as he doesn't know that the bomber is a neutral. Maybe I could limit the rooms capacity the night when the bomb explodes? Only 5 per room that night?

Scum are closer, but I still think they're a tad weak compared to how many self-confirming/investigative roles town has. Potential ideas might be to limit how many guns can be handed out, add the godfather role to one of the scum (without removing their current role), or making the bartender a full on switcher/redirector (less RNG makes the role stronger - could adjust shots if desired). I'm sure there's plenty of other small tweaks that could be done, just tossing out a couple.

And if I change the bartender to have 2 random shots and 2 switcher shot? Scum already have a way of getting a godfather so that wouldn't work.

Maybe making the deflector a 3 shot?
 

Franconp

Frank
Crazy idea for the neutral: He can use his role during the night phase and every player who shares a room with him during that night disappear from the game. They now play a new short game (24/12) in OM where all the players are vanilla townies and he is the only scum. If the vanilla players lynch him he loses the game. If he survive until the end he wins. When the short game ends all the vanilla players return to the main game.

He can only use the role if 3 or more players (not counting him) are in the room.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
I will look for another role. I want to do something related to the rooms. Maybe a role where he can add modifiers to a room and have to affect a number of players to win?



I could limit their post to 2 gifs and 2 hastags per post.



I thought about that and it's unlikely that the bomber would claim as he doesn't know that the bomber is a neutral. Maybe I could limit the rooms capacity the night when the bomb explodes? Only 5 per room that night?



And if I change the bartender to have 2 random shots and 2 switcher shot? Scum already have a way of getting a godfather so that wouldn't work.

Maybe making the deflector a 3 shot?
It’s up to you on the gif/hashtag stuff. I mainly just wanted to point out that the hashtags alone could lead to very unreadable posts. Blarg-like in some of his more..grating gimmicks.

Forgot about the potential reward. Hmm, I think a tweak to the bartender role like you suggested might be enough to close the gap with the auction role now that I think about it.

Crazy idea for the neutral: He can use his role during the night phase and every player who shares a room with him during that night disappear from the game. They now play a new short game (24/12) in OM where all the players are vanilla townies and he is the only scum. If the vanilla players lynch him he loses the game. If he survive until the end he wins. When the short game ends all the vanilla players return to the main game.

He can only use the role if 3 or more players (not counting him) are in the room.
Phew, that is a crazy idea. I have no idea what this would do balance wise. Do the players voted ou of/killed in the short game return to the game after he wins/loses?
 

Franconp

Frank
Yes. Players will return to the game no matter how the mini game ends. But I will lie to them and tell them that they won't return if they lose because I want to give them an incentive so they don't throw that game and try to return quickly to the main game.

The players will disappear of the main game like the people absorved by cell in HvV. No notification, no flip, nothing. I will just remove them from the player list. Players in the main game will receive no info about what happened with the missing players.

I will notify all the players in the mini game that one of them trapped them in the minigame, that they all lost their power while they are trapped, and that they will return to the game if they can lynch him. I will also advise them to not claim their role or aligment in the mini game.

When the mini game ends all the players, except the neutral, will return to the main game no matter the result.

I know that balance wise it's impossible to balance as we won't know which roles will disappear but the game it's bastard so I'm not to concern about that. People signing up know that the game can get really crazy.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
What will the normal game phases be?

My main concern is a world in which the whole scum team (or a large majority) end up in that game and the players in the actual game are stuck spinning their wheels.
 

Franconp

Frank
48/24. So 2 whole phases of the mini game.

It's a possibility. I think it's unlikely as scum don't know what roles town have so they wouldn't all spend the night in the same place.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
I would modify it to be he has to be in a room with at least four other players and that if there are more than four other players RNG picks what four go into the game with him. No lynch is not allowed in this mini mafia game either nor is no kill. Then it will wrap up in one main game phase for sure. Probably just hold the players out of the main game through that whole phase even if they kill the neutral immediately.
 

Franconp

Frank
What Is bothering me Is that, if the player uses his power N1 he will be out of the game at the start of D3. It seems to quick.

I'm thinking of a chance: Every night he has to tag a player who is in the same room as him (targets are not notified of this). When he has 4 alive players tagged they play the mini game.

That way he has to be alive until D5 at least and he has to be careful about who he choose as a target.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
What Is bothering me Is that, if the player uses his power N1 he will be out of the game at the start of D3. It seems to quick.

I'm thinking of a chance: Every night he has to tag a player who is in the same room as him (targets are not notified of this). When he has 4 alive players tagged they play the mini game.

That way he has to be alive until D5 at least and he has to be careful about who he choose as a target.
That’s an even better solution to capping it.
 

Franconp

Frank
Added to the spreadsheets the latest changes and an order of operations.

If both of you thinks we are good I will start working on role PMs.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Thinking about the bomber:

19-5-2

Lets just say the deaths are mostly consistent with only +2 overall (so extra deaths get mostly balanced out when you account for the potential protection from doctor/BP balancing it out).

19-5-2
D1 Lynch
18-5-2
N1 Kill. Bomb Planted.
17-5-2
D2 Lynch
16-5-2
N2 Kill. Bomb remains
15-5-2
D3 Lynch
14-5-2
N3 Kill. Bomb defused
13-5-2
D4 Double lynch/vig
11-5-2
N4 Kill. Bomb planted
10-5-2
D5 Double lynch/vig
9-4-2
N5 Kill. Bomb remains
8-4-2
D6 lynch
7-4-2
N6 Kill. Bomb defused
6-4-2

This also assumes the other neutral doesn't exit and that all the guns going around don't kill at a pace faster than this. It just seems...very difficult for the bomber to win at this rate. Two defuses and they're basically toast. I also still strongly suspect they'll just all pile in one room. Isn't that what we saw in the first Conspiracy iirc?
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Order of Operations:

  • The tag can't be blocked?
  • I don't know that the Freeze is an action so much as a delayed block. If you do want to list it, then it should be first above even the tag (as the neutral could be frozen)
  • Room Blocker is a day command - doesn't need to be in the order of operations since it occurs before the night phase
  • Actress and Oracle can't be blocked?
  • Ghost is a post-death action and doesn't need to be in the order (I assume it just goes into effect the phase after the player's death)
  • Is the handcuffs action simply the linking of the two players? So are handcuffed players not affected by the actress/oracle equally?
  • Should the Deflector be earlier in the queue? I imagine it should be able to deflect the actress/oracle/tag.
  • Roleblocks should be before the strong kill. Strong kills don't go through blocks, just protects.
  • The poison kill, strong kill, ninja kill, and factional kill should all occur around the same time, likely simultaneously unless you explicitly want the mafia to be able to prevent the poison (based on the ordering it doesn't seem like you do)
  • Doctor cannot block the poison right? Since it's not a traditional kill.
  • Bomb defuser should be in the list since I assume it occurs at night? Can occur prior to the block if you'd like
  • Bartender needs to be added
  • the multiple voter bet can't be blocked?
  • Is the light sleeper a night action or day? I know it's passive, but unclear if it can be blocked
Something I want to dive in more explicitly that I don't think we discussed - what all actions impact both of the handcuffed players (this impacts where it should sit priority wise)? I know you said all actions but for instance - if a deflector targets one of them - do the actions that target the deflector affect both as well? What if one of them is poisoned - are they both poisoned? If one of them wins a miller that night do they both become millers? What if the oracle targets one of them that night then dies - do you show both of the roles? Same for actress and amnesic cop. If the tracker tracks one - and they both move doing different things - do they get results from both?
 

Franconp

Frank
This also assumes the other neutral doesn't exit and that all the guns going around don't kill at a pace faster than this. It just seems...very difficult for the bomber to win at this rate. Two defuses and they're basically toast. I also still strongly suspect they'll just all pile in one room. Isn't that what we saw in the first Conspiracy iirc?

I'm limiting the rooms to 5 players each room the night the bomb goes off as we agreed. I forgot to add that to the spreadsheet.
 

Franconp

Frank
The tag can't be blocked?

The tag can't be blocked or tracked. The neutral already has to target players, hope they aren't killed and then survive a minigame of mafia. I think allowing blocking of his action would be too much.

I don't know that the Freeze is an action so much as a delayed block. If you do want to list it, then it should be first above even the tag (as the neutral could be frozen)

You are right.

Room Blocker is a day command - doesn't need to be in the order of operations since it occurs before the night phase

I added it because the multiple voter can bet on players in the locked room even when he is not in that room.

Actress and Oracle can't be blocked?

As both are actions that happens when the player dies I made them unblockeable.

Ghost is a post-death action and doesn't need to be in the order (I assume it just goes into effect the phase after the player's death)

Again, you are right.

Is the handcuffs action simply the linking of the two players? So are handcuffed players not affected by the actress/oracle equally?

They aren't. Only the player who they targeted.

Should the Deflector be earlier in the queue? I imagine it should be able to deflect the actress/oracle/tag.

I was thinking that he could deflect the actress and the oracle but not the tag. But I actually like the idea of deflecting the tag. Will change it.

Roleblocks should be before the strong kill. Strong kills don't go through blocks, just protects.

The old roleblocker vs the strong killer. I already had a big discussion with a gamerunner about this. Strong kills goes through blocks. It says so in Mafia universe, epicmafia and mafiascum. In this case it doesn't matter as both the roleblocker and the strong kill are both scum.

The poison kill, strong kill, ninja kill, and factional kill should all occur around the same time, likely simultaneously unless you explicitly want the mafia to be able to prevent the poison (based on the ordering it doesn't seem like you do)

I separated them because the roleblock can block any kill except the strong kill, only the doctor can prevent the poison and the tracker can track any kill except the ninja.

Bomb defuser should be in the list since I assume it occurs at night? Can occur prior to the block if you'd like

I didn't added to the list as it's not a command. It's a passive. It isn't affected by any other role.

Bartender needs to be added

Missed that.

the multiple voter bet can't be blocked?

Do you mean the bet? It can't.

Is the light sleeper a night action or day? I know it's passive, but unclear if it can be blocked

It's a night action. It can be blocked. I will add it.


Handcuffs:

if a deflector targets one of them - do the actions that target the deflector affect both as well?

Yes.

What if one of them is poisoned - are they both poisoned?

Yes.

If one of them wins a miller that night do they both become millers?

Yes.

What if the oracle targets one of them that night then dies - do you show both of the roles?

Yes.

Same for actress and amnesic cop.

The actress will show only the role of the player he targeted. The cop will check both players (they won't know which result is from which player). If any of them should receive the investigation both will get it.

If the tracker tracks one - and they both move doing different things - do they get results from both?

They will receive both. He won't know which one did what.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
I'm limiting the rooms to 5 players each room the night the bomb goes off as we agreed. I forgot to add that to the spreadsheet.
Ah okay, how will you handle players that attempt to move to a full room? Guessing RNG them to another room if they keep their movement vote there? I'd say you could have them stay in their previous room but that might create an annoying ripple effect.

The tag can't be blocked or tracked. The neutral already has to target players, hope they aren't killed and then survive a minigame of mafia. I think allowing blocking of his action would be too much.



You are right.



I added it because the multiple voter can bet on players in the locked room even when he is not in that room.



As both are actions that happens when the player dies I made them unblockeable.



Again, you are right.



They aren't. Only the player who they targeted.



I was thinking that he could deflect the actress and the oracle but not the tag. But I actually like the idea of deflecting the tag. Will change it.



The old roleblocker vs the strong killer. I already had a big discussion with a gamerunner about this. Strong kills goes through blocks. It says so in Mafia universe, epicmafia and mafiascum. In this case it doesn't matter as both the roleblocker and the strong kill are both scum.



I separated them because the roleblock can block any kill except the strong kill, only the doctor can prevent the poison and the tracker can track any kill except the ninja.



I didn't added to the list as it's not a command. It's a passive. It isn't affected by any other role.



Missed that.



Do you mean the bet? It can't.



It's a night action. It can be blocked. I will add it.


Handcuffs:



Yes.



Yes.



Yes.



Yes.



The actress will show only the role of the player he targeted. The cop will check both players (they won't know which result is from which player). If any of them should receive the investigation both will get it.



They will receive both. He won't know which one did what.
RE: Kills and blocks - that's fine that you'll have the strong kill go through a block then, but it still should occur with the other kills priority wise otherwise the strong kill could kill a person using the poison before the poison occurs. Strong kill can go after the block because it ignores the block occurring (just like a protect). It's relevant since the doctor also can block.

RE: Defuser - So the defuse happens even if the player is frozen, blocked, and/or killed?
 

Franconp

Frank
Ah okay, how will you handle players that attempt to move to a full room? Guessing RNG them to another room if they keep their movement vote there? I'd say you could have them stay in their previous room but that might create an annoying ripple effect.

I will tell them when the day starts that only 5 players max can be in a room that night. If a player moves to a room that is full I will tell them in the main thread that they need to move to another room. If at days end there are still players in a full room I will RNG them into a not full room and post in the main thread where they spend the night.

RE: Defuser - So the defuse happens even if the player is frozen, blocked, and/or killed?

Yes. If the defuser moves to a room he uses his ability.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Is the Order of Operations updated with everything Fran? If so I'll check again and we may be good. Maybe add notes about how the handcuff works with the exceptions if you didn't.

I think I'm okay with the game as is - only other change I can think to toss out is the idea of bumping the bomber to needing 6 kills to prevent a one and done. I don't have strong feelings either way though since it takes awhile for the bomb to go off and the defuser exists AND an item to defuse. I'd approve the game either way.
 

Franconp

Frank
Sorry for the lack of updates. I had some things going on during the last couple of days.

I have updated the design with the new order of operations. I also changed the innocent child and now they can post gifs or just regular images. I'm keeping the 5 bombs. I think getting 5 people once it's hard. Also the bomb goes after the kills so if scum kills one player in that room it won't count as a kill for the bomber.

I will start with the PMs tomorrow.
 
Last edited:

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Bomb Defuser PM:
"wil disarm it" should be "will disarm it"

Tracker PM:
Should probably read "who your target visits during the night phase" as the visit has not occurred yet

Adrenaline Junkie PM:
Adrenaline is misspelled. Might be worth explicitly stating when the death occurs. E.g. "If you are night killed the kill will be delayed until the end of the following day phase"

Crazy Doctor PM:
"and 30% of roleblocking him instead" should be "and a 30% chance of roleblocking them instead"

Neighborizer PM:
PM is unclear - makes it sound like you invite the players by PMing them directly, also makes it sound like they have a choice in whether they join or not

I'll do more later - just had a free moment. Sorry I've been so busy.
 
Legit forgot until Fanto mentioned Conspiracy 2. If this is about Grammar then I'm definitely not the right person for the job, Natiko is it ok if you correct them by yourself?
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Legit forgot until Fanto mentioned Conspiracy 2. If this is about Grammar then I'm definitely not the right person for the job, Natiko is it ok if you correct them by yourself?
Yeah, that's fine - I don't mind.

I'll get them all done before the end of the weekend Fran. Sorry for it dragging out so long.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Tracker PM:
I just noticed it is missing the info about being 3-shot

Smith PM:
It says the player can send the gun during the day, I thought based on the description on the role tab it was a night command? E.g. N1 start making gun, N2 can send at 50% or continue to make gun, and then if continued to make can send a 100% gun N3

Innocent Child PM:
I'm guessing the command should say REVEAL not REVEL. Did you decide to go with just gifs and images in posts for the restriction? If so that's fine, just double checking.

Hunter PM:
The phrase "one of the players who voted for you will be killed randomly during the same day phase" could be slightly tweaked to read "a randomly selected player who voted for you will be killed alongside you once the day phase ends"

Amnesic Cop PM:
"know" should be "check"

Oracle PM:
Last minute question about the Oracle - if they target Player A on N1, then target Player B on N2 and are both roleblocked and night killed - does it reveal the role of Player A on D3 or no role is revealed? If it is the former the role PM is fine, if it is the latter then it should be updated to say "the role of your target" (removing the word last)

Mourner PM:
I assume it should specify that the day command is sent via PM?

Overrider PM:
"make all the votes null and lynch your target instead". "2 or more votes on them (not including your own vote) when you issue the command."

Vote Gambler PM:
"select the player that you think will be" "After you use it"

Scum PMs:
They all say "You are infiltrated government agent" and it should maybe be "You are an undercover government agent". One indicates the partners will be highlighted and the others don't indicate that (just pointing out the discrepancy). All but one do NOT have the factional Kill command highlighted and they all should. Also not sure if it's standard to mention the one night action a night limitation or not.

Roleblocker PM:
It's cut off after the command and doesn't state what the command does

Strong Ninja PM:
"make a kill that will bypass". "Also, once per game" All three modifiers say "make" a kill and should instead probably say "perform" a kill. "All of these commands are modifiers to the factional kill. They are not additional kills."

Actress PM:
"and if you die during that night phase or the following day phase you will flip with the role of the player you targeted instead of your own."

Neutral PMs:
"noone" should say "no one"

Bomber PM:
"plant a bomb in the room you are currently occupying." "to arm a planted bomb in the room you are currently occupying. Both commands". "You may have more than one bomb planted at a time." "After a bomb has been armed it will blow up in 2 night phases." QUESTION: Can more than one bomb be armed at a time? It reads like they can. Just checking the intent.

Game Master PM:
"If there are 4 tagged players alive when the night ends you and the 4 tagged players will be banished from the main game." "on Outer Mafia" "You win when you win the Mafia Minigame. If you lose the game or your win condition becomes unattainable you will die." (Adding the last bit in case there are no longer enough players left alive to tag - very unlikely but still)
 

Franconp

Frank
I made all the changes.

Did you decide to go with just gifs and images in posts for the restriction?

Yes.

Last minute question about the Oracle - if they target Player A on N1, then target Player B on N2 and are both roleblocked and night killed - does it reveal the role of Player A on D3 or no role is revealed? If it is the former the role PM is fine, if it is the latter then it should be updated to say "the role of your target" (removing the word last)

The Oracle goes before the roleblocker so it can't be blocked. In that case they will reveal the role of Player B. If he Target player A N1 and forgot to target anyone N2 and is killed he will reveal Player A role.

They all say "You are infiltrated government agent" and it should maybe be "You are an undercover government agent".

I deleted that because I think that I won't make scum undercover agents. I had an idea for a different flavour yesterday and maybe I will go with it instead.

QUESTION: Can more than one bomb be armed at a time? It reads like they can. Just checking the intent.

They can't. I made a mistake in the PM.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Innocent Child PM
"during the remainder of the game"

Random question out of curiosity:
Does the ghost affect the bomb planting and arming? What about disarming?

Bomber:
I thought maybe they could plant more than one at a time but simply not arm more than one at a time. If they can't even plant more than one at a time what is the point of making it two different commands? Unless each command is impacted by the ghost and you're wanting the ghost to impact the bomber extra hard? Also "it will blow of in 2" should be "it will blow up in 2"

Scum Flavor:
I think I realize what you were going for with "infiltrated government agents". I think you can get the same point across by just making them government agents in general - the infiltration is implied by all of the conspiracy nuts. If you really want to lean into it you can change the room names to be based around a government facility or base or something. Or you can go with one of your other ideas - just a thought I had.
 

Franconp

Frank
Random question out of curiosity:
Does the ghost affect the bomb planting and arming? What about disarming?

No.

Bomber:
I thought maybe they could plant more than one at a time but simply not arm more than one at a time. If they can't even plant more than one at a time what is the point of making it two different commands? Unless each command is impacted by the ghost and you're wanting the ghost to impact the bomber extra hard? Also "it will blow of in 2" should be "it will blow up in 2"

I just thought of making them different commands because, if the bomber don't win with the first bomb, town could look at who spend the night the night before the counter started and find the bomber. If he plant the bomb in one room one night, and then spend the next night in another room and then arm it he doesn't leaves any trails (I just realized that I didn't said that he can arm the bomb in a different room, just added it to the role PM). So he has 2 options: plant and arm in the same night and leave a trail if he doesn't fulfill his wincon in the first try or wait one more day to play it safe.

Scum Flavor:
I think I realize what you were going for with "infiltrated government agents". I think you can get the same point across by just making them government agents in general - the infiltration is implied by all of the conspiracy nuts. If you really want to lean into it you can change the room names to be based around a government facility or base or something. Or you can go with one of your other ideas - just a thought I had.

My original idea was make it a continuation of Conspiracy 1 but now I'm liking more about making all of them people trapped in a bunker who turn on each other. I'm thinking like Cloverfield Lane. They will be told that something happened outside and they are trapped inside the bunker for protection and some of them turn crazy and start killing the others.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
No.



I just thought of making them different commands because, if the bomber don't win with the first bomb, town could look at who spend the night the night before the counter started and find the bomber. If he plant the bomb in one room one night, and then spend the next night in another room and then arm it he doesn't leaves any trails (I just realized that I didn't said that he can arm the bomb in a different room, just added it to the role PM). So he has 2 options: plant and arm in the same night and leave a trail if he doesn't fulfill his wincon in the first try or wait one more day to play it safe.



My original idea was make it a continuation of Conspiracy 1 but now I'm liking more about making all of them people trapped in a bunker who turn on each other. I'm thinking like Cloverfield Lane. They will be told that something happened outside and they are trapped inside the bunker for protection and some of them turn crazy and start killing the others.
Ahhh, okay the arming from another room was the bit I was missing. Looks good.

Once you decide on the final flavor and faction text flavor I think this is wrapped!
 

Franconp

Frank
I fixed the PMs with the new flavour.

Now town are people who are locked down in a bunker to protect them from some catastrophe and scum are conspiracy nuts who are crazy and start killing the rest of the people.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Small note - Dining Room is misspelled on the sheet. Otherwise I think everything is good to go.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Teamwork makes the dream work. Thanks for being timely with updates Fran, and thanks for all the help in reviewing Geno. Got through that review pretty fast for the size/complexity of the game!
 

Franconp

Frank
Thank you both for the help!!

I'm really happy with the game as it is now and both of your contributions helped greatly for that.

What are the next steps? Do I need to tell someone that we are done reviewing? It's been a long time since a submited a game that I'm not sure how to move this forward.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Thank you both for the help!!

I'm really happy with the game as it is now and both of your contributions helped greatly for that.

What are the next steps? Do I need to tell someone that we are done reviewing? It's been a long time since a submited a game that I'm not sure how to move this forward.
I actually went ahead and did all that for you. It should be in the approved section and the review team has it marked as ready to go. All that’s left now is waiting on the Scheduling team to see when it might run and they’ll reach out to you at that time.
 
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