Pair Thread Dr. Monkey x Stuart444 Suite

[Stuart444]

I think you're right about Kyan and donna. Donna kept her vote on purpose on Bae and malus but with her reads, she switched.

here's what she said:
Pirate Bae & Malus: Our claimed cops, whom green checked the tybro team. I believe in them and their claim.

Nice catch. I read over her post but didn't catch the turnabout there.

Now on the assumption that they are town aligned. (yes I love doing assumption games):

Scum wouldn't mind them being killed to stop them interfering with scum chat
Scum also wouldn't mind Bae being lunched (which would kinda confirm she was telling the truth about the chat thieves) because the more 'confirmed' townies that Town kills, the better for scum to kill unconfirmed townies during the night.

Why am I saying this? Because I think it will be interesting be it now OR in retrospect who is trying to push Bae and who is also trying to push the possibility that the chat thieves are scum.

Of course this falls apart if the chat thieves are scum but I feel like they have more utility to town than to scum. (locking a scum member from their chat) The fact that they got a claimed cop into their chat was just luck since bae claimed in the last minutes of the day more or less.

 

[Stuart444]

Sorian: 53 Stuart444: 49 Dr. Monkey: 45 Fantomas: 39 Terraforce: 27 Natiko: 24 TheChuggernaut: 23 CoolestSpot: 23 Pirate Bae: 21 Z-Beat: 20 Kyanrute: 14 Brazil: 14 rac: 14Vincent Alexander: 14 flatearthpandas: 11 Geno: 11 absolutbro: 10 FluxWaveZ: 9 Funky Dude Sparks: 9 Apollo: 7 Verelios: 7 SkyOdin: 6 empressdonna: 5 Xbro: 4 malus: 3Stantastic: 3 Reki: 2 B-Dubs: 2 Zippedpinhead: 2

huh? I know B-Dubs posted more than twice. I've got him at four. Just kinda wanted to see if anyone hadn't posted at all yet and how low some of them were.

Post Counts:
Sorian: 68 Stuart444: 54 Dr. Monkey: 49 Fantomas: 48 Natiko: 33 Terraforce: 31 Pirate Bae: 27 Z-Beat: 24 TheChuggernaut: 23 CoolestSpot: 23 Vincent Alexander: 18 FluxWaveZ: 16 Kyanrute: 15 rac: 15 Brazil: 14 Verelios: 14 absolutbro: 13 flatearthpandas: 11 Geno: 11 Funky Dude Sparks: 9 Apollo: 7 B-Dubs: 6 SkyOdin: 6 empressdonna: 5 Xbro: 4 Reki: 4 malus: 3 Stantastic: 3 Zippedpinhead: 2

Click here to go to the Vote Tool!

 

[heymonkey]

Oh, I didn't refresh it, that would be why.

I agree with you re: chat thieves. I think for now it is a better bet to assume that team is town. Kyaaa is kinda, well, Kyaaa but donna's earnest effort reads town to me and I think the role is more likely to be town.

 

[heymonkey]

I've got some things to do and then dinner stuff but I'll be checking in here and in thread on mobile.

 

[heymonkey]

It also makes sense for Kyan to pull Bae into chat because they are friends as I recall, or at least way back in my first game they were v chummy.

 

[heymonkey]

Let's pretend we are right and all the checks and claims are right:

Us
K&ED
PB&M
(Ty)&AB
all town

That's a decent town circle.

 

[Stuart444]

Let's pretend we are right and all the checks and claims are right:

Us
K&ED
PB&M
(Ty)&AB
all town

That's a decent town circle.

indeed and it narrows down who we need to focus on.

Though I suspect if we are anywhere near right, we're going to be offed in the night.

 

[heymonkey]

I'm going to vote Sorian when I get back. I could be wrong but his self-focus is just too extreme here.

 

[heymonkey]

And as long as some people keep scumreading us a little, we are unlikely to die, at least.

 

[heymonkey]

I also rescind my earlier statement (in the main thread) that Brazil and Sorian can't be scum together. I actually think that could explain why Sorian is being so weird about Flux and why he stopped pushing for Brazil at all.

 

[Stuart444]

I also rescind my earlier statement (in the main thread) that Brazil and Sorian can't be scum together. I actually think that could explain why Sorian is being so weird about Flux and why he stopped pushing for Brazil at all.

I decided to call Brazil out since we've not heard from him much today.

I am still very wary of Flux though right now.

 

[Stuart444]

What do you think about Brazil's weird response?

 

[heymonkey]

I really don’t know.

 

[Stuart444]

Well. that's a post from Brazil.

 

[heymonkey]

It hate posts like that. Calling something “bad lines” doesn’t mean anything. Can’t even defend against it. And those early votes had no substance. So big shrug.

 

[Stuart444]

So what do you think? Brazil likely scum or no rn?

 

[heymonkey]

It feels weird to put up a bunch of day one stuff without being caught up but I assume Brazil would know it seems weird. I’m interested in seeing how people respond to him, I think, and how he is after.

You?

 

[Stuart444]

It feels weird to put up a bunch of day one stuff without being caught up but I assume Brazil would know it seems weird. I’m interested in seeing how people respond to him, I think, and how he is after.

You?

Brazil in general feels different than both his town game (most games I've been with him in) and Scum (I think KH Mafia was him and Muffin?),

 

[Stuart444]

I almost feel like pointing out that There is reason to believe the chat thieve PRs are town (like I said above, it has more utility to town than scum).

but keeping that to ourselves may be better to see how far people are willing to argue against them.

Plus keeping quiet about our knowledge of Kyonna being the Chat Thieves (assuming we're right which I see no reason to think otherwise atm) gives us some good information while trying to out scum today.

 

[heymonkey]

I almost feel like pointing out that There is reason to believe the chat thieve PRs are town (like I said above, it has more utility to town than scum).

but keeping that to ourselves may be better to see how far people are willing to argue against them.

Plus keeping quiet about our knowledge of Kyonna being the Chat Thieves (assuming we're right which I see no reason to think otherwise atm) gives us some good information while trying to out scum today.

I agree - I think we keep it under our hats for now.

 

[heymonkey]

I'm looking at some of B-Dubs' past games and feelsbadman. He was less formal and more direct, and not at all focused on summary like this.

 

[Stuart444]

Being on purposely vague about why you think it's a town power?

 

[heymonkey]

I'm really just kind of over having the same conversation about it with Sorian.

 

[heymonkey]

He is really the only one screaming IT'S TOTALLY SCUM so it feels pointless.

 

[Stuart444]

Can't disagree with that.

 

[Stuart444]

no idea how it worked in LB2 but is it possible for scum to not have a scum chat and instead have several different pairs of scum?

 

[heymonkey]

They're all here in s9 - you can see them. LB2 had one big scum chat. I suppose it's possible they have pairs but the question would be why do it that way?

 

[Stuart444]

They're all here in s9 - you can see them. LB2 had one big scum chat. I suppose it's possible they have pairs but the question would be why do it that way?

I was more thinking, that would make the chat thieve power a really strong power for town. it would cut one pair of scum off entirely from the other

 

[heymonkey]

I was more thinking, that would make the chat thieve power a really strong power for town. it would cut one pair of scum off entirely from the other

It would. But in my experience, Bear often doesn't make hugely powerful roles (Mafiera was kind of an exception).

 

[Stuart444]

Yeah, it was just a musings is all

 

[Stuart444]

That said, Sorian has done more chat thieve hunting than scum hunting today

 

[heymonkey]

ahhh, there it is, Xbro mentions that I and Sorian talked about the number of posts in our boat. I believe he's wrong, btw; I think at least one other person mentioned it.

 

[heymonkey]

re-reading brazil's post just made me mad
when has scum in this community outed themselves within hours? wtf

 

[Stuart444]

re-reading brazil's post just made me mad
when has scum in this community outed themselves within hours? wtf

It's an odd narrative and one that certain people have stuck by this whole time

 

[Stuart444]

Also I noticed something

There isn't much examining of todays posts by people who suspect us? Is it just me or am I right about that?

All the scum reads are based off D1 and there is no real attempt to look over todays stuff

 

[heymonkey]

Also I noticed something

There isn't much examining of todays posts by people who suspect us? Is it just me or am I right about that?

All the scum reads are based off D1 and there is no real attempt to look over todays stuff

Nope, I think you're absolutely right. Geno left early. Sorian is just sticking to it. Brazil's whole thing was d1/not caught up, which is fucking weird. It's SO fucking weird I almost don't want to scumread him because of it.

 

[Stuart444]

Nope, I think you're absolutely right. Geno left early. Sorian is just sticking to it. Brazil's whole thing was d1/not caught up, which is fucking weird. It's SO fucking weird I almost don't want to scumread him because of it.

In the absence of anything better, it is anti-town. (so is Geno but urgh).

Sorian first though!

 

[Stuart444]

Starting to feel like using the word defensive is basically a case of "I have nothing better" in an argument

 

[Stuart444]

tempting to call out all these reads based on D1 but then I'd be "defensive" urgh

 

[heymonkey]

Yep. It’s why I didn’t do much with Brazil’s post.

Ugh I’m having sudden doubts about Sorian. What if he’s just cranky town? I hate this. I do it every game.

 

[Stuart444]

Yep. It’s why I didn’t do much with Brazil’s post.

Ugh I’m having sudden doubts about Sorian. What if he’s just cranky town? I hate this. I do it every game.

No way, you'd have to somehow be able to argue that everything he's done has been in towns interest. Sorian is a good player remember.

I just can't see anyway for him to be town.

 

[Stuart444]

He called out a breadcrumb publicly in the thread (one that some noticed, others did not but it's anti-town regardless).

He's spent most of his time not scum hunting and a lot of self-centeredness. He cares more about finding the chat thieves than doing any proper scum hunting.

 

[heymonkey]

I mean, he’s smug. I can see him doing all that out of smugness. But you’re right. Signs point to him as scum unless maybe he’s right about the gossips.

I do have a small thought we should hold off on gossips AND Sorian until tomorrow but honestly I think this day will come down to thunderdome regardless.

 

[Stuart444]

I mean, he’s smug. I can see him doing all that out of smugness. But you’re right. Signs point to him as scum unless maybe he’s right about the gossips.

I do have a small thought we should hold off on gossips AND Sorian until tomorrow but honestly I think this day will come down to thunderdome regardless.

I don't believe he's right

That said, I want today to come down to a thunderdome (I may not even be around at EOD though) because I feel like if we don't, tomorrow will be basically today - 2 townies (unless we magically hit scum)

 

[heymonkey]

Yeah. After that it will get real serious.

 

[Stuart444]

Sparks 'reason' is like, wtf.

Geno makes me think town but Sparks just makes me think scum. I know I know. I shouldn't expect to get anything useful out of Sparks but posts like that...

Feels almost policy lynch worthy if I didn't already firmly believe that Sorian was scum.

 

[Stuart444]

if Sorian and B-Dubs are scum, I'm feeling Feps/Stan is as well.

Still iffy on Brazil/Flux but I wouldn't mind them either.

 

[Stuart444]

I HATE when I have read lists that are based on "if X are scum"

but that's how I'm feeling right now. On their own, some posts are a bit "wut" but together and if the first pair are scum, others actions suddenly become that much more suspicious.

 

[heymonkey]

I could go feps/Stan. Stan I can usually find but he’s not here for me in this game.

 

[heymonkey]

And feps is way too quiet and passive.

 

[Stuart444]

Should I claim vanilla for the lolz? Probably shouldn't but it's tempting

 

[heymonkey]

I basically just softed it but I don’t think we should claim.

 

[Stuart444]

I am even more convinced that Sorian and Dubs are scum with that post from Dubs.

Very opportunistic "Yeah, Monkey's actions haven't changed, she's scum" basically.

 

[Stuart444]

I remain wishing for a TD power to happen hahaha.

 

[heymonkey]

I should take a break. I'm pretty mad.

 

[Stuart444]

You're doing well, better than me. I'm taking deep breaths to avoid going into outrage mode like I usually do.

People never listen to outrage Stu lol

 

[heymonkey]

I get especially mad when people say stuff that’s so easily fact-checked.

 

[heymonkey]

You're doing well, better than me. I'm taking deep breaths to avoid going into outrage mode like I usually do.

People never listen to outrage Stu lol

Team Mad

 

[heymonkey]

I think the next time someone says some dumb shit I'm just gonna post the Fury Road bait gif.

 

[Stuart444]

Team Mad

Hahaha.

but yeah I feel you there.

I'm also on record at being horrible with wording but still people like to take my wording apart and refuse to listen to me about it haha

 

[Stuart444]

I think the next time someone says some dumb shit I'm just gonna post the Fury Road bait gif.

:D

 

[Stuart444]

Feeling bad for AB. lucky he got that green check because he's still on his own here.

 

[heymonkey]

Yeah, I wonder what's up with the replacement.
Is there literally no one? We have a whole list of folks.

 

[Stuart444]

Yeah, I wonder what's up with the replacement.
Is there literally no one? We have a whole list of folks.

That's what I thought.

 

[Stuart444]

Z-Beat now as well.

 

[heymonkey]

Replaced out?

 

[Stuart444]

wow. Brazil's post has me pretty fucking pissed now.

 

[heymonkey]

I'm just fine with being voted out. I don't even want to go back to the thread.

 

[heymonkey]

I mean, I will tomorrow. But I'm not right now.

 

[Stuart444]

I treat all suspicion as acts of aggression? I certainly don't. I however do treat and act out against shots taken against me (ie Geno's shit earlier in the game. I don't give two fucking shits if this is a game where some aggression may happen. There is still a limit and we should still have some respect between the players)

Any actual suspicion, I will question and if I don't see the reason as good, I'll call it out. The same way every fucking person does.

urgh....

only reason I'm posting this here is because I wouldn't post it in the main thread because again, it will just be "You've proved my point"

 

[heymonkey]

vent your rage here, buddy

 

[heymonkey]

I treat all suspicion as acts of aggression? I certainly don't. I however do treat and act out against shots taken against me (ie Geno's shit earlier in the game. I don't give two fucking shits if this is a game where some aggression may happen. There is still a limit and we should still have some respect between the players)

Any actual suspicion, I will question and if I don't see the reason as good, I'll call it out. The same way every fucking person does.

urgh....

only reason I'm posting this here is because I wouldn't post it in the main thread because again, it will just be "You've proved my point"

ugh. I'm sorry. That's pretty shitty, yeah.

 

[heymonkey]

I don't know when we got in this meta of defending as bad. It wasn't always like this.

 

[Stuart444]

Here's the problem: you treat all suspicion as acts of aggression, even though you don't know the alignment of the people suspecting you. Instead of engaging with arguments, you just whine about them. Not only does that not help other townies figure you out, it also makes them less likely to back down from you.


My argument was framed as an analysis of D1 from the get-go. It's not a "tired old D1 argument" - it's an argument that arose overnight after D1 in hindsight. You don't get to put up an arbitrary barrier that says you don't need to engage with arguments because they're referencing the previous phase. Your alignment is still the same today as it was on D1.


If you're actually town, you're not helping anyone with this shit. Certainly not your partner.

This is the post that pissed me off here btw.

I'm not helping town or you. yay

 

[heymonkey]

No, the problem is when analysis becomes attack.

 

[heymonkey]

and there's been SO MUCH attack

 

[Stuart444]

and there's been SO MUCH attack

agreed but I am not elegant enough in my wording to argue my case without it somehow making me look worse to everyone. urgh.

That said, I'm happy I got partnered with you. It feels nice to bounce ideas off someone like this.

 

[heymonkey]

Me too. It's been really nice and I think all the chats are not so active.

 

[heymonkey]

Sky's read on Sorian is literally my read on Sorian. hmm.

 

[Stuart444]

I may be digging a hole here defending our chat thieves but hey, in for a penny, in for a pound.

 

[heymonkey]

If they are scum... lol. RIP, press f, etc.

 

[heymonkey]

But I support you in this. At least for now, they should not be outed.

 

[Stuart444]

Being outed would get them lunched probably if people buy into Sorian's narrative. We'd be doing scums job for them basically

 

[Stuart444]

I'm also starting to wonder, IF Sorian is scum, does that chat thing affect scum in a way that makes him want it gone asap?

Then again, it could just be Sorian (Scum Sorian...) being hyper focused because it distracts from having to pretend to scum hunt haha

 

[heymonkey]

I do see a world in which Sorian might not be scum. I have a hard time seeing that world with B-Dubs, though. As for the chat, if he's scum, yes - I think he probably latched on to it the same way I did the cult in Mafiera. You have something to do that isn't fake.

 

[heymonkey]

I dunno what to think about Sky here. I guess I'll let it go.

 

[Stuart444]

I do see a world in which Sorian might not be scum. I have a hard time seeing that world with B-Dubs, though. As for the chat, if he's scum, yes - I think he probably latched on to it the same way I did the cult in Mafiera. You have something to do that isn't fake.

Yeah and going this hard on it is pretty Sorian-like.

Remember (if you saw it) Sorian vs Faddy in a recent game where Sorian talked about how his claim to fame (or something like that) would be how he got Faddy lynched and was right about him being scum or something like that.

it ended up being townvtown iirc XD.

 

[heymonkey]

sorian gonna sorian

 

[Stuart444]

anyway I've been up all night so I'll be here as long as I can but almost assuredly won't be around at EOD. Sorry ;_;.

I need to get my sleep in order for thursday, got a docs appt in the morning and the best way to do that is usually an allnighter followed by a long ass sleep haha.

 

[heymonkey]

It is what it is and you have to take care of yourself! I'll be here for EoD.

So I've been fine on Chuggs/Sky all game but I will say I find this Sky stuff weird and Chuggs turning up then is also weird, but I'm just gonna file it.

 

[Stuart444]

It is what it is and you have to take care of yourself! I'll be here for EoD.

So I've been fine on Chuggs/Sky all game but I will say I find this Sky stuff weird and Chuggs turning up then is also weird, but I'm just gonna file it.

I'd say keep on town reading them openly.

If they aren't scum, they will get NK'd for that.

If they are scum, they will still be around in a few days.

Best thing to do if you're not too sure atm.

 

[heymonkey]

Oh, that's a good strategy.

 

[Stuart444]

Best I've got until a slip up or inconsistency happens haha. Or until something that cements them as confirmed town in my head happens haha.

 

[Stuart444]

I love CS but I also have no idea how to handle him haha.

 

[heymonkey]

Ugh I have to go to bed. Keep your thoughts coming and I’ll post all mine while you’re out and we will tag team. Hope we live.

 

[Stuart444]

Ugh I have to go to bed. Keep your thoughts coming and I’ll post all mine while you’re out and we will tag team. Hope we live.

Fingers crossed but if we get voted out, no big loss to town PR wise and we can vent in spec chat finally hahaha :P

 

[heymonkey]

Stan is town. I’d bet on it. If he’s not I’ll cry. And CS too I guess. Double isn’t scummy.

 

[heymonkey]

So Stan/feps
Sky/Chuggs
Probs town

CS def town

Kyan/Donna - gossips
Probs town

AbBro/Fat4All checked maybe
PB/malus - claimed

If all these are town plus Geno, maybe, we got this. That’s half what’s left.

 

[Stuart444]

Stan is town. I’d bet on it. If he’s not I’ll cry. And CS too I guess. Double isn’t scummy.

agreed

So Stan/feps
Sky/Chuggs
Probs town

CS def town

Kyan/Donna - gossips
Probs town

AbBro/Fat4All checked maybe
PB/malus - claimed

If all these are town plus Geno, maybe, we got this. That’s half what’s left.

I refuse to out Kyonna before the game does, otherwise, I think we should get this out there at some point.

At the very least if we are right about Sorian and he IS lunched. we will be almost certainly NK'd as I see no way people would vote us out after that.

 

[Stuart444]

All right, I'll leave a simple list then. In no specific order other than memory and going down the list.


scum lean

• Dr Stu - the fight with sorian today and the continued push across two days feels weird as hell and doesn't really get us anywhere, feels less hunting and more justifying.
• Bae-Malus - I'm not feeling great about the way it's all played out. Bae was and still is unwilling to give us much of anything, we wouldn't even know who the green check is on if not for Malus. Beyond that, Bae's confidence in the thieves being town seems oddly strong for something that seems NAI, so either they gave her some info to convince her and I'd like to know what sort of thing that is or this is a scum gambit to protect a PR. Whole thing just feels off to me so far, Bae has essentially put out two green checks with one of them being unattached. If they were scum this seems like it would be an ideal scenario to save someone from suspicion or a lynch down the line.
• Kyandonna - neither leave a strong impression and both have barely been around (like I can talk), and it feels like they might be hiding out a bit
• Zipped & Fanto - this is mostly on Fanto, but there's something off there that I can't quite place. It might just be the game size and doubles aspect (both of which are giving me issues too). This is the one I def wouldn't go for today, but I give Fanto side-eye all the same.
• Funky & Geno - Geno made his 10 posts and straight up dipped and Funky has just been weird and when confronted with the fact he was largely just agreeing with other he said "Hi have you met me? Im awful at this game and I can't read people worth a damn so thank you jesus for a doubles game but hot damn I will admit Im terrible at this omg" which is oddly defensive for what was asked.

neutral

• brazil & fluxwavez - originally I was iffy on brazil and considered this a scum lean, but then he started putting out long and well thought out posts so I move him to neutral
• coolestspot & z-beat - coolest has a double and z-beat has been putting out reads and pressure.

That's about what I got so far.

I continue to think Sorian and Dubs are scum. Even ignoring our team, the read list doesn't give me good feels.