It seemed to me like there was a pivot to no going in on HB, realizing there was a bit of a slip and setting up a pivot, and then a bit of CYA hedging on the claim.
Currently giving galleon the benefit of the doubt, thinking you've caught a scum/scum pair off an early day 1 post feels more like misplaced town optimism than a scum opener.
I kinda see what duck is saying, it looks to me like Houseboat wants to be contrarian for the sake of it instead of just saying something more personal like "I know a few people like sub but I'm not seeing it yet"
Oh yeah, forgot that pings are easier to fire off here since it's not like you're casually browsing the site like era.
By the way, any water vessels you like so far @Beluga Whale? You're higher up in post count but I don't have much sense where you are with the game so far.
There's been some talk of strong words and slimy would be one of them for me. Can you expand on what you mean here about their engagement? Is it the jokey-seeming interactions you have highlighted or the way they have responded to other players?
It seemed like your opening vote on sub was jokey and happened before they garnered town reads but you're now saying that you voted on principle based on the reception they were getting?
Lifeboat brought it up already but this posts flows a bit odd with you landing on houseboat. The tie you're referring to breaking is a 2:2 between houseboat and sub so I don't think someone who is reading the room would see that going either way. I think I would have preferred if you stayed closer to your read and voted me rather than constrain yourself to an existing wagon.
The tone of this post feels off, like you're trying too hard to play nice. I'd almost say it feels coached, which:
I'm not seeing the town thinking behind holding a prepared statement in case you face further pressure. Vote: Houseboat
I think you've gotten confused with a post I made on Galleon here.
Don't want to weigh in too much on the protective claim but I think I agree that waiting is the lower risk play as house should be caught scum or dead town walking.
Skiffs attempt to tie me us in to Lifeboat looks opportunistic.
Not really seeing the Kayak case just yet, seemed like the disagreement with Gondola was more a playstyle difference (find town vs hunt scum) more than anything telling.
I wouldn't say I have a town read on them, I shared some concerns around their vote on Houseboat not lining up well with their thoughts at the time but some of the newer stuff they are being scum read for just seems to be a playstyle thing and isn't convincing me. I definitely felt better about the push on HB earlier in the day and having delayed resolution on that slot is going to be annoying.
Tried to look back over them but don't have time for a reread on mobile. There are moments of confidence from Galleon that seem townier to me e.g asking to "prove the negative". If HB is town the odds of at least one scum on there is good and it'd probably be between duck and Galleon for me as I'm good with Gondola/Inflatable
We were pretty gung-ho on our scum read of HB so the claim gave some whiplash. I think I'd still feel better if the claimed doc was dead this morning, let's see if they coast on that claim.
I'm not sure I would call it gung-ho. Yacht never really pushed HB just made some safe remarks. Maybe it's a semantics thing but when I see someone say they are gung-ho in these games I would assume they were leading a push, that's definitely not the case here. And then the later portions just feel like positioning knowing that HB would get exposed at some point.
It's not the tighest argument that I have ever made for sure. But I have been in those situations where a teammate slips, you try to cover and then realize you need to pivot, and then they pull something out of their ass and you need to pivot again.
It seemed to me like there was a pivot to no going in on HB, realizing there was a bit of a slip and setting up a pivot, and then a bit of CYA hedging on the claim.
Slight shade on Gally for their initial HB read and vote.
Trying to excuse HB.
Some slight defense work here.
Now we start pivoting.
And here is the vote, 4th on HB at the time.
Now going full bus mode.
Casting doubt on the claim.
Castes doubt earlier but now pulling back a bit.
Here it seems like the full pivot is on. They hedge by saying "If HB is town" but it used as a justification on where to vote.
I'm not sure I would call it gung-ho. Yacht never really pushed HB just made some safe remarks. Maybe it's a semantics thing but when I see someone say they are gung-ho in these games I would assume they were leading a push, that's definitely not the case here. And then the later portions just feel like positioning knowing that HB would get exposed at some point.
It's not the tighest argument that I have ever made for sure. But I have been in those situations where a teammate slips, you try to cover and then realize you need to pivot, and then they pull something out of their ass and you need to pivot again.
Day 1 lifeboat, Day 2 lifeboat will probably have to wait because I'm running out of time for the moment. I should have started with D2 tbh.
Life's very first read disagrees with Galleon making a thing of the pregame joke with an incredibly overdone paragraph about why House/Duck are unlikely to be partners as the reason for Galleon being a candidate instead of anything Galleon said.
Vibes scum read on Yacht. The first of many Yacht reads this phase.
Not much to go off of, but so far based on vibes I'm also in camp Town-Submarine.
Vote candidates for me are Galleon and Yacht. I'm not a fan of the reasoning based on the pre game joke. While it is the case that Scum know their team, in my experience they won't make it this obvious unless they post in the wrong thread by accident. In fact usually Scum have a harder time interacting with each other than with Town, so if anything I'd say Houseboat and Duck are probably not Scum/Scum.
Yacht is more vibes based. Their read on Galleon feels a bit off I think, not sure why it's bothering me though.
Defends House against Duck's harsher accusation of concern trolling.
And uh, I'm not entirely sure how to explain why the bottom half of this bothers me so much but it's basically along the lines of "They also know what House meant with the comment about Sub despite the fact nobody else did until House clarifies later"
Everyone else pretty much thought the shade was against the people offering town reads.
Life on the other hand talks about House actually not agreeing with the town reads, that is scum reading sub, which is the same thing House says later when they explain. Over explain. Whatever they were doing here.
Correct. One of us likes Sub, and one of us does not. We agreed that if I can produce a better argument for somebody else, then we will change our vote.
I'll speak since I'm the half of our account that has these points. So, basically, I always worry when someone gets townread based on stuff they have posted in the opening hours. That isn't to say there's nothing to be learned there, of course, but I voted there merely for the principal of the matter. As I've discussed with my other half, unless there is something major that happens with Sub, our vote will not be on Sub when the captain sends us to dock for the night.
I'm very glad you brought this up, allow me to explain better. When I first voted for Submarine, yes, it absolutely was a joke vote. As the game progressed, however, instead of moving it off of them, I kept it on them for the reasons I listed in the big post you quoted.
As of right now, though, Submarine is not my account of interest, and thus...
UNVOTE
I appreciate you calling me out of this though so I could further elaborate!
And while House is admitting to having their timeline and vote reasoning tangled Life offers a non-read there despite the fact that Duck's good posts at this point were arguably the ones on Houseboat.
that vote on houseboat is so hesitant and clause filled. It is half way through day 1. You don't need a good reason to vote for anyone but it seems like they were feeling exposed by not having a voted down. I honestly don't even know why they voted other than to fit in. I don't see how pressuring houseboat does anything but it looks like they are playing when they are not really engaged at all.
Responding to a request on reads for Duck and Yacht:
I liked the thought process here, it shows an interest in trying to solve by being able to better read player pairs. It’s small, but early on I like the initiative. Idk that I fully agree with their appraisal of others during this discussion, but that’s not a big red flag or anything.
I don’t really disagree with their assessment here. Houseboat is currently feeling off to me from their posts so far. I’d entertain a vote there especially for extra pressure, because so far it doesn’t feel like there’s much in the way of defense for them either.
At this point I’d say Duck is a small town lean, enough that I probably wouldn’t consider voting there today.
Yacht is more interesting in that I think their posts feel a bit more “fluffy”. There’s content, but often it isn’t content that feels directly like it’s coming from a town mindset. There’s discussion, but not much in the way of firm stances imo. I’d say a light scum lean, would at least consider a vote here today as well. Honestly - would maybe be my preferred vote, though with the tie that’s down right now I’ll push to make things more interesting instead:
Not sure what to make of them tbh. The posts confusing the timeline do seem to be quite damning on a reread. Why not come forward with the clarification on their own if they knew it would be a source of confusion?
Also this post feels strangely doomerish:
I don't feel like there is a general sentiment against them but they seem to be convinced that if HB isn't voted out it's going to be them.
Hedging that they don't know what to make of them and finding something bad to say about them in case people don't back down as majority draws nearer?
And then pulling an entirely separate post from Galleon to try and point attention there instead.
And we have not discussed where exactly our vote will end up today. I am not convinced by Kayak, I like their response to me in that it felt a more genuine post then their big houseboat vote post but it was tinged with a bit of frustration which is NAI
I personally was not convinced on the houseboat thing. Submarine can you walk me through what exactly the slip is and why it is alignment indicative. And are you a fair person to assess this since the vote was on you. Feels a bit OMGUSSY to me.
I like Beluga and Submarine as town so far. No one else is really moving the needle as a town reads so far.
Asks Submarine to explain House's slip and is undermining them in the same post saying them commenting would be omgus even though they asked (which I also find that funny considering Sub showed approximately zero omgus towards House all day)
Also the Kayak post they mentioned was like, nothing, and they made no mention of the Kayak posts just above that were challenging House.
==
House claims
==
Now House claims in 486 and Life is immediately on the claim.
It could be a fake claim. But let's say we have a doctor. What benefit do we get from outing them right now? The whole point of a doctor is to get a save and counterclaiming removes that possibility. If there is a doctor battle to be had it can be on day 3.
if you fake claim doctor you are doing because you want the counterclaim so you post with a couple of hours to go so that everyone has time to see and react to the claim. The counterclaim is what a fake claiming mafia wants and it is why we should not give it to them.
I am not 100% that Houseboat is town but I think it is way more likely that they the doctor than any fake claiming nonsense. Voting them today is ridiculous.
I read through Kayak's posts and there are no town vibes at all. it is all very stilted and strained. Someone who seems flustered and argumentative about everything. it is day 1. Townies should be chill
Thinks the claim is basically perfectly timed to be a scum claim, but it's more likely they're for real.
Also tries to offer an alternative point of interest in Kayak in the same post.
Tries to misrepresent Kayak as moving off due to the claim when they didn't.
It is interesting that neither Galleon or Yacht have moved off Houseboat. No clue what it means but it certainly is INTERESTING. Where as Kayak moved off houseboat ASAP.
I can see Yacht. Sheeping and some fluff in their posts. I will follow onto Yacht if that is the call.
If Yacht is mafia i would let Kayak go for a bit. What Yacht has said about Kayak and the vote from Kayak onto Yacht does not seem like they are the same alignment.
Yet again mentions both slots together.
Fucking weird offer to Submarine and Inflatable to vote so Lifeboat can potentially hammer. It's actually Jet Ski and Inflatable who vote, but that still allows the hammer.
Summary of that post about Lifeboat on D1 because ain't nobody gonna read that last one:
Sets up Galleon as their vote candidate while arguing against Gal's read on House.
Knows what House is talking about with regards to their Submarine shade when nobody else does.
Considers Yacht scummy all day in a non descript way, and rarely mentions them without also mentioning Galleon so they can both be scum options together.
Feels like they never put forth a read on House without having an alternative ready to go.
I am getting criticised for not contributing as much which is fair. Since I was green checked I have been ready to make decisions much faster. i can't believe this phase is 24 hours.
We are in almost exactly the same knowledge position we were yesterday. We got Beluga as town. Time to take that conclusion and move.
I am getting criticised for not contributing as much which is fair. Since I was green checked I have been ready to make decisions much faster. i can't believe this phase is 24 hours.
We are in almost exactly the same knowledge position we were yesterday. We got Beluga as town. Time to take that conclusion and move.
There are several posts from this account and others going over you, I suggest looking at those. The arguments are coming from D1 and D2 not really even your post D3 coasting.
There are several posts from this account and others going over you, I suggest looking at those. The arguments are coming from D1 and D2 not really even your post D3 coasting.
No one was convinced by what I said on those days either. It took a cop check to save me.
Honestly they made a bad choice, they should have checked Yacht instead of me.
I was ready to be extra salty with my ghost day but since missing the end of day where y'all messed up and somehow turned Skiff into voting for themselves I have cared way less about this game. I keep seeing these warnings about being chill and I am just not on the same plane as the the people who seemingly can't keep things civil
Galleon has an attitude what I somewhat liked, but it do be NAI. Tbh I am not sure what was the reasoning for the Houseboat vote in the end, was there a retcon or not? Tbh that should make it a less good vote then, because it being ambiguous means that it struggles to be played as a "I voted for reactions/content/making things move" vote. Not that it has been played as such, but I kind of was hoping for a moment that'd be the next step eventually.
Faking interaction like good meanies should be, or just townies using the tools that they have been given? Can't rule out the former and could see it being the latter. Though now that I read the quotes again, they are both from #1. Huh. Just huh, don't think it is more than that.
Maybe you don't like it, but I think we're more successful when we look for town, that's something I believe in when it comes to mafia and I'll keep playing that way. Cruise asked how the pairs might affect our reads, I tried to think of a way it might be a benefit and not a hindrance, particularly in the early game with a wash of accounts that look the same and posts switching between users. Finding something townie isn't the same statement as ignore something overtly scummy.
I get being wary if you perceive that someone is trying to create an environment where they can handwave anything scummy (even if it's a kind of uncharitable take on what my point was) but this response just reads like you don't want to discuss it at all, which makes the original point feel less in good faith. Carry on, really?
Kayak disagreement, noting it since this was the basis of their "scum read" on the slot but is a very NAI conversation. It's also the thing HB picks up to propel their Kayak scumread.
Alright, caught up on some of the stuff that happened since I was last on. The Houseboat thing with the prepared post is bizarre lol I don't quite know what to think of it. I think I have an idea of who the player might be and that makes me feel less like it's a slip and more like an eccentricity but it's the other stuff I don't like about their play today, I feel like I've tried to approach them a few times (#252, #348) on trying to striaghten out their thought process on the parts that weren't really checking out and they didn't respond at all, it feels a bit like they've picking the questions they think they can respond to. I suggested to my partner yesterday that Houseboat might be a good vote but they are relatively busy and haven't posted much to exchange reads or come up with a vote we are agreed on but this is where I'd like to go
5th vote onto HB after mounting towny pressure. Downplays the slip as an "eccentricity". Some hedging where scum read is based on lack of responses (which can be addressed) and partner is absent and open to switching.
RE: Houseboat. Galleon-friend has been showing intrest in going there for a bit now and I too am by now interested. The recent events with seemingly retroactive reasoning and/or timeline confusion, keeping a pocket explanation, not doing what would presumably be the logical next move from the explanation, and not explaining why the logical move was not done is a clunky set of steps to take for town.
Trying to hail my partner. Kayak is the only other account that caught my eye in a strong way today since they didn't seem to want to actually discuss their observations, but I don't think I want to follow houseboat despite the claim. If Kayak is who I think they are, the forwardness is relatively within their wheelhouse anyway and probably isn't indicative of alignment either way.
Kayak caught their eye in a strong way (4:3 Yacht:Kayak here) since they didn't want to discuss. But doesn't want to follow HB despite the claim? Later seems they bought the claim. Mentions having an idea of who Kayak is and thinking forwardness is NAI.
Alright, partner hasn't showed and I'm not voting last minute or causing a tie last minute. There isn't much to Galleon on an iso beyond the houseboat stuff, they had a pretty singularly focused day so let try it
Ties things up 5:5 with 10 minutes left in the day. Seemed to be town reading Galleon either, not sure if they gave a read on us and I missed it. Doesn't look like much thought was put in to this vote.
We've been leaning towards a Yacht/Sub team, though at this point that's probably part and part 'I can't look over D1 and not see Sub defending House anymore' and, for lack of a better way to phrase it, the result of PoEing it down now other pairings we were considering there are dead.
It seemed to me like there was a pivot to no going in on HB, realizing there was a bit of a slip and setting up a pivot, and then a bit of CYA hedging on the claim.
Sorry I am dumb you might need to break this down further so I can see where you are coming from.
Looking back over HB I think these were the main posts that got flak on day 1:
1. Joking that duck should win the game
2. Questioning an early wide town read on Sub
3. Saying that their vote on Sub was based on their questioning from 2. when it was a joke vote made prior
4. Pre-typing a post to clarify 3. if needed
There could be more I'm forgetting, but those are the ones I recall.
This is a town read on Galleon for their confidence in that vote based on 1 and doesn't really mean anything for HB/Duck alignment. Galleons opening vote is not well reasoned or something anyone can follow - it doesn't become a good vote in retrospect because HB was scum and they were town.
So this is where 3. happens and this is where the HB case becomes legitimate in my eyes as they attribute a reason for a vote that could not exist when they cast it.
If you are saying this is a pivot, do you feel HB was scummy already at point 1. or point 2. in the timeline above?
When you say pivot here what is the movement from and where is it going to?
This was me trying to figure out the counter wagons to myself (Galleon, Kayak) as I was not big on either. The "HB is town" part was posed by Cruise.
Ties things up 5:5 with 10 minutes left in the day. Seemed to be town reading Galleon either, not sure if they gave a read on us and I missed it. Doesn't look like much thought was put in to this vote.
You won't particularly like the answer to these but they were made by a player that hasn't been here since day 1, made about 5 posts, and barely chatted with me, I didn't interact with Galleon at all D1 and basically had no read on them at day end. I was relying on us coming together and having a read on the larger player field for D1 and it didn't happen. I picked the best choice I could at the time after they no showed, you weren't on my radar until thinking more about the off train vote the next day.
Kayak disagreement, noting it since this was the basis of their "scum read" on the slot but is a very NAI conversation. It's also the thing HB picks up to propel their Kayak scumread.
You might think NAI, but when you play with people in the community you build up an idea of what you think they do when they try being scummy and don't and I thought I knew who it was and it pinged me for the disinterest in engaging. It was enough for me to check them night one, but when my partner came on board and caught up they thought I was reading too much into what is the norm so we put it aside after getting no motion to see more from the slot. It's specifically the HB picking it up and how they put effort into trying to make it something that makes me think Kayak is more than likely town with houseboat's alignment.
5th vote onto HB after mounting towny pressure. Downplays the slip as an "eccentricity". Some hedging where scum read is based on lack of responses (which can be addressed) and partner is absent and open to switching.
It's not a downplay, I felt there were more obvious basic issues with the slot refusing to actually say anyone it was suspicious on or address the fact voting Sub because of other player's logic not checking out made no sense at all. My vote wasn't hedgy there at all, I asked for some basic answers, went to bed, got up and caught up and saw they had completely ignored me (again) but been plenty active so I voted there.
Kayak caught their eye in a strong way (4:3 Yacht:Kayak here) since they didn't want to discuss. But doesn't want to follow HB despite the claim? Later seems they bought the claim. Mentions having an idea of who Kayak is and thinking forwardness is NAI.
The doc claim was super conveinent so I was a wary of following the slot. The thread basically agreed to take the claim as it was and put them aside for the day so I attempted to take that in stride at day end and make the best vote I could at end of day. The vote was bad because Galleon was town but it was the shot I had at the time in a busy day I had been playing alone, it is what it is. I think my play has spoken for itself as the game has went on.
I was definitely put off by the way Kayak presented themselves and engaged later in the day, felt like they were just taking a negative view on things and weren't really willing to engage in discussion back the way. This was a slot I had a think about with my partner over night though and we think they're just within their usual zone. I don't think this is a slot to go after today.
While the vote caused a tie, I wasn't trying to achieve anything by creating a tie in that sense as much as i had been pretty settled on the idea houseboat would be resolved and the day phase was probably wrapped up so i went away from the game for awhile. Then I came back and realised i was going to have to squeeze in some reading and figure out who was the best vote I could make in the time I had to play , so i was mostly just focused on making that happen and and getting the vote i came to down asap so that i didnt cause anytihng like a draw in the last minute. There wasnt any process like "if there's a draw i will see what x does so ill go or that" or that kind of thing.
Explanation of their Galleon vote. Wasn't trying to do anything with the tie. Was settled that HB was resolved (did they buy the claim or not?)
Why was Galleon the best vote? They had liked the slot earlier in the day.
Sub - Still feel good about Sub. Sure their vote was on Galleon early and that push didn't work out but I thought their play during the day phase was strong in terms of giving reads without prompting, engaging others, saying who they would not vote and so on. They also did not go after houseboat at all. It just feels like loud towny and unless the slot tails off massively I think it would take still being around later and things to be going badly for me to think otherwise on it. Quiet so far this day phase but there’s 48 hours.
houseboat - this slot was in a dicey spot before the claim. Willing to take that on face value for now and let the claim play out and accept my read was just off but do want to point out that I've noticed the second partner just doesn't seem to have come back at all since the claim lol, @Houseboat has the other one been put in boat storage?
Town read of Sub, does mention they would worry if slot is kept around later. HB read is based almost entirely on the claim while other reads have more depth.
Kayak - weighed in on kayak earlier but this is one I considered over the night phase because it had caught my eye a bit in the previous day phase and got me a little omgusy but after going over it, I think this slot is fine.The initial votes yesterday do read a bit hedgy some of the play/takes are too strong for me, but my gut is saying not to worry about this one right now, their play is progressing a way that checks out to me so far. They’re engaging people in a forward manner, there’s no sense that they’re holding back or worried about getting into it with folks. This is more one I’d be concerned if they slid into the background later in the game.
Lifeboat - going over their iso, I like their general engagement, I feel like there's moments where they keep a level head on things in a towny way like calling out being close to hammer, their reaction when the claim happens, the offer to hammer to prevent a draw or shenanigans reads wel, that’s the kind of stuff it’s easy to just sit back and just say nothing so it feels more towny to act. D1 they have a kind of small size pool of who they engage with but they are consistent within that pool. Votewise they were on Kayak, ends up moving to Yatch but seemed happy for either to be solved which felt like a general thought adopted at day end.
I will definitely vote for houseboat in a thunderdome scenario here, it checks out to me that the second partner totally dipped out of fear of getting in hot water again.
Imo there's no sense in Cruise Ship sharing any info about their role, it can only benefit mafia. Houseboat needs to be the vote today, they managed to get themselves an extra day already but we can't keep stepping around this slot with all the noise around it. #807 basically reads like open wolfing anyway lmao
I'm a bit sad Skiff hasn't been around while Life has been Lifeboating, I'd have liked to see their reactions to it, but I don't know if I'd have gotten anything from it.
This is a town read on Galleon for their confidence in that vote based on 1 and doesn't really mean anything for HB/Duck alignment. Galleons opening vote is not well reasoned or something anyone can follow - it doesn't become a good vote in retrospect because HB was scum and they were town.
Shade was likely not the right wording from me to describe that because you are right you were giving them a slight town read at the end. I think dismissing might have been better wording, you say it was just optimistic town rather than thinking that they might have been on something.
It reads like you are trying to explain for them rather than letting them explain themselves if that makes any sense. Like you're trying to find an excuse for how they were reacting.
So this is where 3. happens and this is where the HB case becomes legitimate in my eyes as they attribute a reason for a vote that could not exist when they cast it.
If you are saying this is a pivot, do you feel HB was scummy already at point 1. or point 2. in the timeline above?
I will need to re-read HB to see where I think they were on the timeline (which admittedly is going to be a bit tougher since I wasn't in then and I go in knowing their alignment so everything off is going to be more amplified). I don't feel like you had a lot behind your reasoning on that vote but I could just be setting an unreasonable expectation for a mid-dayish D1 vote.
When you say pivot here what is the movement from and where is it going to?
This was me trying to figure out the counter wagons to myself (Galleon, Kayak) as I was not big on either. The "HB is town" part was posed by Cruise.
You were really casting some shade on the claim but you didn't seem to factor that into what you were saying about Gally. If you were really curious about the claim why hedge like you were with Gally? I know your vote did not go there in the end but you made it seem like you were certainly open to going there.
Okay so my Big Read / hot take is that EoD yesterday was town vs town with Kayak Vs Sub.
If Kayak is on a team their partner did very little to save them by letting the votes build up over the course of the day instead of starting a counter wagon. Kayak was also sharing their thoughts near the last minute when a vote from skiff or us could have hammered them. Add this with the HB interactions and I think Kayak can be town.
@Yacht this is your read on me and sub yesterday. What made you go to me having to be scum today?
Also what is your scum case on me? I saw your breakdown for Gon. Im curious to what makes me scum in your eyes now.
I feel like if you were town you would be pushing me very hard to be flipped. It would be very easy for you to argue I am scum with the wagons day 1(if you were town).
I'd want to go Yacht, my partner has been spending the time they've had free today going over Lifeboat stuff, not exactly sure where they're at right now since they're been at work
Can either one of you make cases on why you think gon and/or yacht are scum? You are greenchecked and arent really putting anything out there for town to get a feel of your thinking. You posted earlier to defend yourself, but not to solve. You wanted to rush a yacht vote earlier. Earlier you were just saying how you think there is a heavy link between Yacht and Sub.
You also said you thought Gondola was town earlier this same day phase.
I guess. I think it is harder for you. Especially with the way I have played which tbh has not been great. I would have rather have killed you on skiff day. But I wasn't around at the end.
Honestly since then you have been solving imo. At this point I feel like Yacht knows their win condition and is trying to push it. And maybe I should see that as mafia.
I'm not sure who their partner is but i don't think it is you. I would really have to think about Submarine. For as much as i like them as town the actual vote logic and their reads are HEAVILY aligned with yacht who I think is the most likely to be mafia.
So if you are asking why I haven't voted Yacht for the last few days it is because I have been pocketed by Submarine. For the last couple of days all they have said is Yacht is town. Which is why I put them together on that post even if i didn't believe in submarine as mafia. For me submarine is weird because of the call out of a slip on houseboat but if it is yacht they hedged and voted the wrong way on day 1.
So my current thinking is Yacht for sure then IDK. I feel like gondola's role fits for town. And as i said on day 1 you aren't with yacht. So it is submarine??
We're out of shots, so no results from us. We thought scum might prioritise us over Lifeboat for the NK if we kept the shot number to ourselves when no one really asked, but I guess they didn't go for it.
We've been leaning towards a Yacht/Sub team, though at this point that's probably part and part 'I can't look over D1 and not see Sub defending House anymore' and, for lack of a better way to phrase it, the result of PoEing it down now other pairings we were considering there are dead.
My other half has already posted walls on Yacht, and on the Sub part I struggle to look back over D1 and not see them running a counter offensive for House (deflecting Galleon on their behalf, largely not engaging with the comment about them, the positive reads on them coming out of it, and their defense of the slip), and that's also one of the reasons I've liked your slot because you pulled that up.
But that was before F5, and at this point I want to check over all the combinations left and see if anything sticks out I haven't noticed before. Especially after you and Life came into the day together trying to get us to hurry instead of think and I really cannot state how much of a splash of cold water that was.
If now is the time we get to discuss Lifeboat again I also want to take the chance to do that because they are the slot I've felt worst about all game.
We accepted the check because we trusted Duck and it was a valid explanation for what we thought we saw happen there, but although I might have told my partner that I would put that paranoia aside I'm not sure I ever really did.
I should still have some quotes I was pouring over N2 for that if I can gather them into something that resembles a post, and there have been some since that made me grimace too.
Summary of that post about Lifeboat on D1 because ain't nobody gonna read that last one:
Sets up Galleon as their vote candidate while arguing against Gal's read on House.
Knows what House is talking about with regards to their Submarine shade when nobody else does.
Considers Yacht scummy all day in a non descript way, and rarely mentions them without also mentioning Galleon so they can both be scum options together.
Feels like they never put forth a read on House without having an alternative ready to go.
We were just talking about that in our chat. For me personally I would have them more likely as scum than you however I feel like they have done just enough today to cause some doubt in my mind that I personally am not super confident in my scum read on them...I'm like 60/40 or 55/45 or something like that that they are scum.
It looks like everybody at one point today had Yacht as Scum. Feels like if there's two Scum left they would try to push away from their partner in mylo.
This half of the sub (sub prime) as never fully town read yacht but has felt better about them than other scum leads more or less all game. I feel with their posts today they still proc as more townie to me and I'm worried they are a miselim. Plus after my LB read I'm way more in agreement with sub sub in their suspicions of them and I want LB more.
It looks like everybody at one point today had Yacht as Scum. Feels like if there's two Scum left they would try to push away from their partner in mylo.
I figured they would be prepared to go full bus with whatever direction I needed. I did find it interesting that the other four had Yacht as a potential which did cause me some hesitation there but I think as scum you would bus and buy yourself another day if it came to it.
There's two different people you've quoted there though and tbh I think my partner put it pretty clearly in the second post than I can re-iterating it. They've been less sure about your slot while I basically put it on a shelf and said okay let's go with it as a green check unless we get to a point that doesn't make sense. We're in the final five and it's worth looking at anything that hasn't sat right at this point so we don't fumble.
This half of the sub (sub prime) as never fully town read yacht but has felt better about them than other scum leads more or less all game. I feel with their posts today they still proc as more townie to me and I'm worried they are a miselim. Plus after my LB read I'm way more in agreement with sub sub in their suspicions of them and I want LB more.
So who do you have teamed with Life?
Life + Kayak = One of you said I was your top town read
Life + Yacht = Seems to be one of your top town reads
Life + Gon = You were just defended Gon heavy earlier.
Tldr: Scum moved to save Yacht D1. Yachts wagons seems to be pure.
Let's revisit Day 1 again.
This is the vote an hour and a half before eod.
HB posts this right after that vote snapshot
Weird post since HB gave Yacht neutral read earlier, so no one expected HB to go to Yacht. Them staying put makes sense. I was one of their biggest scum reads.
Vote 35 minutes before eod D1
Im town, we know Gal is town.
Everyone on yacht's vote is town. So where all the 3 other scum at votewise? We know one was on me.
If all 3 of these wagons are town, scum wouldnt care at all who goes. They should be content with whoever goes. So why does HB make it a point to move at all?
30 minutes before EoD
This vote opens the flood gates for the galleon wagon
Votes for Day eod
So once again with iBoat being heavily town read, yacht's wagon seems to be pure.
I have said I haven't ruled it out because we have seen it before but yes I have said in my mind its Gondola vs LB and you vs Yacht because of the D1 vote. As for D2 neither yourself, LB, nor Gondola is on the vote at all so I don't think that's going to be a good vote to look at one way or another.
So who do you have teamed with Life?
Life + Kayak = One of you said I was your top town read
Life + Yacht = Seems to be one of your top town reads
Life + Gon = You were just defended Gon heavy earlier.
So it's Life + ????
I wouldnt read Gon expecting the NK to be the green check as a town read.
Shade was likely not the right wording from me to describe that because you are right you were giving them a slight town read at the end. I think dismissing might have been better wording, you say it was just optimistic town rather than thinking that they might have been on something.
It reads like you are trying to explain for them rather than letting them explain themselves if that makes any sense. Like you're trying to find an excuse for how they were reacting.
Oh I meant that they chose to express it in a way that went against the grain but not in a personal way. Like I wasn't saying "I think they are intending to say X but expressing it poorly" I was saying "If they meant X why didn't they say X?"
You were really casting some shade on the claim but you didn't seem to factor that into what you were saying about Gally. If you were really curious about the claim why hedge like you were with Gally? I know your vote did not go there in the end but you made it seem like you were certainly open to going there.
I think I was taking the question more as who looks worse if HB flips town that night so I looked at who had the weakest votes on there IMO. Duck and Galleon didn't really react to the slip much which was odd to me, if you are scum reading someone and they mess up why doesn't that motivate you to push harder on them? In hindsight that could have been a good play e.g Advocating for setting aside HB but pushing back on votes which assumed a town HB to avoid them scoring double credit on a fake claim but I didn't think of that in the time we had to move wagons.
That doesnt really answer the question.
Also, it's not the same really. I find some scummy things in all 3 of you that could be linked to Yacht. While you have given townreads/leanings to everyone.
It seems like you are sure on Life, but hesitant on Yacht.............when you said this earlier about Yacht.
Based on the D1 votes (which I know is not a sure thing) I think its between Gondola and Lifeboat for one pair and Kayak and Yacht for the other. I think personally I am coming down on feeling like its more likely Lifeboat and Yacht but I was also pretty damn confident about Beluga so I'm not quite sure.
I tried to look at the reactions to the Doc claim during the night, but didn't really came to a solid conclusion.
Yachts stands out as one of the few that openly doubts the claim. I'd like to hear their thoughts now that we've had some time to let it simmer.
During the night they were looking for the reactions to the Doctor claim. Why? Wants thoughts from Yacht about why they were a doubter but they don't give any reason why the reactions to the doc claim was their focus or why they think that would help them find scum.
You said you thought there might be scum between Duck and Galleon but you didn't put a vote down. Were you worried about the perception of you self preserving?
I wanted Kayak dead because they weren't contributing. Their reads and vote felt forced. They did not seem to be having a good time like the whole game was a strain.
These are things i normally associate with people who are mafia
I think this is the second time their read on Kayak isn't based on anything Kayak has actually said or done? It seems weird not to point at something Kayak has actually said or done and instead just to say they seem like they're not having a good time?
obviously if they started participating more I would re-evaluate. but until they actually give me causse to i don't know why I would change my scum read on them. Obviously some other flips might also change things. i said that i don't see them with yacht.
As far as Yacht is concerned it is strange they did not do anything at end of day despite being there. if it turns out they are scum then Galleon should learn a lesson that you need to vote for the person against you. If it was sitting at 6-5 in favour of voting out yacht then the day doesn't end on Galleon imo.
i really wanted inflatible to make the casting vote just for receipts. If they pick the mafia then it is all good. So I was kind of annoyed that Jet Ski was son antsy at end of day. but also inflatible should be making a decision way earlier. I don't know what to make of them dithering tbh. Did they see Jet Ski move before they voted, unlikely, but we can't know for sure.
Is this the return of the "say something about a teammate only when they can follow it up with something about someone else" with the comment tacked on the end about not knowing what to make of Inflatable's "dithering"?
But that last paragraph also bothers me for a different reason and has been in my head for a few hours now and I don't know if I'm reading too much into it or just enough.
Does this sound like more of a statement than a what if?
Like they're not considering if there was a mafia train, but instead admitting there was one?
I feel like it does, but at the same time it would be a very strange thing to say about someone picking a teammate to hammer. Unless it's fine because they were already ready to vote the other way anyway, the way they did?
I find myself looking at House not wanting to look at the D1 votes, and House not wanting to chase Life when they slip over the 2-shot thing, and Life saying 'if they pick the mafia it's fine', and wondering if that trio could just be the answer.
But uh.
That was me going off on a ramble.
Back to the ISO.
They're not prepared to hear anyone doubt House's Doctor claim, because the moment someone tries they shut it down:
The moment someone expresses doubt about House they shut it down:
Just a little sus the claimed doctor survived, but I might be a bit jumpy. I dunno if they've changed their mind, but my partner was still sus of Houseboat last night when they came back.
We never vote houseboat without a counter claim (wait until day 3) or we see a flip that contradicts.
For why they didn't die. Mafia saw they claimed 2 shot and decided they could live with it. Was Jet ski the person you thought was going to die last night? I mean they were decently town read but i wouldn't put them as top town.
of course we could be wrong about submarine and keeping doctor alive gives more plausibility for them to continue in the game.
Nope. It was only ever referred to as the "doctor claim". I am in the camp that it is real, my partner was after reactions arround the claim but didn't get any solid reads
I said I expected Houseboat to protect Submarine and I guess my partner was after receipts early in justifying who HB protected.
What did you and your partner think of Houseboat's claim and potential actions?
When the original claim was made i think. In my head they were always 2-shot. I think I even said about having a doc battle on day 3. Maybe i got messed up then but I was thinking they were 2 shot during the night when I was considering whether I expected mafia to kill them.
I think regardless mafia should have just killed them. Although since they didn't that probably has implications too. They aren't afraid of the doc. You absolutely kill the doc if you don't have a counter. For example if they let the doc live and then a cop says today they have a red check then they are still going to get another check. unless they really were worried about a self protection.
I still think the situation is likely to resolve itself
@Lifeboat did the wait until day 3 comment come from the same half that thought HB was 2-shot or the other/both halves? Was the thinking wait until the claimed shots are burnt or that scum will resolve a real doc within that timeframe?
Taking a break for a while, I still find Skiff to be dodgy in what they have posted and feel like they haven't been discussed much. Houseboat I really want to see resolution soon because it feels a lot of cases hinge on taking their claim as proof of innocence. Might reread Cruise Ship as well.
The waiting for D3 was from me (the half that didn't think it was 2-shot). The reasoning is that on D3 who they protected N1 probably wouldn't influence who they could protect N3. The question about the target is mainly so we have some receipts early in case more info is revealed later.
To the game: I think Yacht not self preserving at EoD1 points to them being Town. In my opinion the vote could have gone either way until the end, so not voting would pose a substantial risk and nobody would have questioned the vote either. Even if they misread the time remaining, their team would have probably told them to vote, so that's a further point in favor of them not having more players to coordinate with.
Houseboats reaction to the "slip" seems Towny. If they are Scum they could have easily used it to push a vote but opted not to.
Still feeling okay with Sub. They're not as active today as they were D1, but not enough to make me worry they'll coast on the early Town reads.
When the original claim was made i think. In my head they were always 2-shot. I think I even said about having a doc battle on day 3. Maybe i got messed up then but I was thinking they were 2 shot during the night when I was considering whether I expected mafia to kill them.
The waiting for D3 was from me (the half that didn't think it was 2-shot). The reasoning is that on D3 who they protected N1 probably wouldn't influence who they could protect N3. The question about the target is mainly so we have some receipts early in case more info is revealed later.
This is actually the scummiest take on the whole thing
If houseboat isn't mafia they are going to assume houseboat is actually the doctor. Why waste a role cop on that. The whole point of a role cop is to find the town PRs you don't know. I guess it sounded good in your head.
To show what type of doc they are. Even/Odd or X shot.
So when the slip happened how did everyone else think Lifeboat would know Houseboat is X shot and the number of shots?
The way Life comes at this as "that's not what a scum team would do with a role cop" as an explanation feels like it's an exchange that's treating Kayak as wrong town, rather than scum with "the scummiest take" on why Life would have said 2 shot?
And then I also pulled out the Houseboat reaction to the claim where they choose not to pursue it because I still think that's just scummy as fuck and the fact Life was trying to continually misrepresent what I was saying when I tried to say as much on D3 still bothers me.
That is a bit strange but I can accept a brainfart, it would be quite hypocritical of me otherwise.
From ISOing Lifeboat they had a pretty townie Day 1. They were concerned with finding scum. They were quite consistent on thinking Kayak, Galleon, and Yacht were scum so no strange votes. They had a high post count which I know of course is not perfectly indicative of town but is more often than not during early game. I respect that they took lengths to avoid a tie at day end. Scum can want to avoid ties at day end to make the game go faster but generally a tie is a bigger pain for town than scum in my opinion. I would mark them down as light town for now.
I think ultimately it does not affect my read very much at the moment though I will certainly keep it in the back of my mind for later if Lifeboat starts acting stranger.
I still don't see why, if they're not partnered, House doesn't take this chance to push Life. Especially once people start theorising that their alignments could match, if Life were actually town here them flipping would be a good thing for House, but they just don't go for it.
Why not? I made a post before that I was scum reading Galleon and Houseboat. I really though that they were scum. I even said in my chat that I could even saw them paired. Houseboat claimed and I freaked out in my chat. We were talking about what to do when people started saying that we shouldn't counter claim. So we decided to stay silent. I had my vote in a player that I felt could be scum, even be Houseboat partner. Also I was too worried that doing something could expose us.
No. But Lifeboat's post really read like a slip in our eyes. If I'm right, 2 scum for 1 doctor is a good trade. If it weren't for it I don't know if I would have claimed.
And Lifeboat agrees Cruise is probably the real doctor, but does the same hedge shit they pull on D1 when they talk about house, they do it with another talking point: Cruise is probably the real doctor but have you looked at Beluga?
Cruise Ship is probably the real doc. It would be a super pessimistic scum that counter claims the doctor with no votes on them less than half way through the day phase. It also explains why Houseboat didn't die last night.
I am a bit piqued by the point Beluga brought up. Why vote the same way as someone you know is scum especially on a close vote. And also that Beluga was pretty quick on that like they spent the night phase trying to work out what the criteria for the real doc is. Because they already knew Houseboat was fake.
I wouldn't say impossible BUT it is very unlikely. They would be out of shots on night 7. What are the chances a 13 player game makes it to a 7th night. Absolutely none.
(And after seeing House literally get counterclaimed we have this stepping back from their prior preferred vote of Yacht as if they feel like they actually have to justify it after scum got counterclaimed.)
And again, just look at this (long) EOD exchange again and tell me it isn't one of the scummiest things you've ever seen.
We go from "Cruise Ship is probably the real doc." and House's claim "is very unlikely" to them just digging in trying to get anything else out of Cruise as other people try to deflect.
I think having already claimed and without elaborating on other thing you can answer this yes or no. The is an inference from this post but just for clarity.
It does matter. If we have an odd and even night doc and Cruise is just hard decided that two docs cannot exist then we don't have all the info we could have.
Why can't we have an odd and even night doc. All Cruise needs to say is I'm not Even night and I would be 100% that we were not walking into an error. Houseboat is going to die because of a counter claim, but if one is odd night and the other is even night then it isn't really a counter claim.
I am suspect of the shot limit but that could have explanations. Either it is a hold over from when the role had less shots or mafia has some shot removal mechanic or some other unknown condition.
if Houseboat is town, they already committed to not killing them. Why go half way on it. Maybe they are saving the shot thing for the cop.
I don't understand why Cruise Ship won't answer the simple question. I think it is unlikely we have an Odd/Even doc but the possibility exists. And if Cruise Ship is an Even doctor did they not expect an odd night doctor?
Saying i am not an even night doc gives us assurance that things do not fit while also not really giving mafia any info of what their doctor restrictions are.
It matters if we kill houseboat and they flip town then you need to make a choice on Cruise Ship.
What would you do if they said they were even night doc tomorrow? Would you give them the benefit of the doubt and still put them in the town pile or would you still think they need to be solved? They can take this one possibility off the table today.
What if mafia role cop'd Houseboat to see their restrictions and this is a mafia gambit by Cruise Ship who is going to try and weasel out of it with an Even doctor claim.
Maybe none of this matters and houseboat flips mafia but i don't think we are losing anything or putting Cruise ship at any more of a disadvantage to get a small bit of info today.
If Cruise Ship did say they were even night I would be more vocal about not killing Houseboat.
If Cruise Ship is even night then the chances houseboat is town goes up dramatically. Since they would not only have to be able to claim doc then the mafia team would have to role cop the real doc so that they could work out what restriction to admit to. And we don't know that mafia even has a role cop. We have seen two vanilla roles so it isn't like this role madness.
That makes it important for Cruise Ship to answer the question.
If they are even night doc it makes it likely houseboat is town and we are making a mistake.
We have to get the info out today. We can't go into tomorrow with the possibility we kill a town doc and cruise ship, who has gone silent probably hoping y'all hammer, can reasonably claim "my bad, I'm even night doc"
And they could do this as either alignment which makes it even more of an issue. They could be town making a bad judgment or they could be scum acting malicious. I just want the possibilities of odd/even doc off the table.
What info? I have a claim that i already shared. I already threw myself under the bus to give you scum. What more do you want? (besides info on my role, which you can get whenever I flip).
I even gave a read list before I claimed.
But here it is again:
I'm sure Houseboat is scum.
Lifeboat is likely scum. The slip is them sharing info of Houseboat's false claim here by mistake. Also every post after my claim is extremely sus.
Yacht could be scum. Houseboat tried really hard to shade them D1 but always gave an excuse for not voting them.
Submarine is likely town. So is Gondola,Beluga and Infatable. Kayak seems town, Houseboat tried to get them lynch yesterday.
Skiff and Duck are null. Duck is a little bit townie than Skiff, who is just coasting.
It just keeps going and going, fishing for more information to try and get House some wiggle room with their claim and or get more information from the doctor who they keep shading at the same damn time.
It felt ridiculous watching it happen at the time and it reads more so on a readback, it's just relentless.
There was also explicit talk of a cop in the midst of that, along with a weird bit of design speculation about mafia having a shot remover.
I am suspect of the shot limit but that could have explanations. Either it is a hold over from when the role had less shots or mafia has some shot removal mechanic or some other unknown condition.
it felt like a bit of a stretch but I don't think it was it bus.
If it is between us and another player today it should be Yacht. Houseboat voted for Galleon on day 1 over Yacht. Yacht has been kind of scummy. i am getting shit for being edgy during a medic counter claim yesterday but I literally just wanted to cover every possible angle. Cruise Ship say "i'm not even night doc" and I am 100% happy. now everyone has seen the Houseboat and Cruise Ship flip ask yourself if that info would have helped mafia in any way.
Where as Yacht knew Cruise Ship was real and immediately voted for Houseboat.
Yacht throwing away a vote off wagon in case they die i can see. I do not think that says anything about Skiff. If Yacht is mafia shouldn't Skiff be getting credit for voting them on day 1?
I would need to look into the circumstances of their vote.
Yes. They know Cruise Ship is real, everyone believes Cruise Ship. Vote early, end the day. Stop town from talking.
i never doubted Cruise Ship was actually the medic until they stopped being open which did put a tiny doubt in my mind. i was more worried it was possible odd/even docs and we were on a potential path to destruction where we chain vote out two doctors. Trying to get a tiny bit more info to ensure we weren't in that situation is all I was trying to do.
i'm not with Yacht. i was fine with Yacht dying and if inflatable had voted before Jet Ski shifted I think Yacht would be dead.
And I had already said i didn't like Galleon either. Which IIRC was the exact same place you were in which is why i thought we shoudl be the ones to hammer and stop any nonsense. Because if there was anything suspect going on we had already said we were hedging between two people and therefore should be down to hammer either one.
I think if Yacht turns out to be bad then you look a lot worse.
Haven't had a chance to go back over day 1 in depth or connect with my other half much overnight but surface impressions from that flip.
Really like Inflatable, thought they had a strong day 2 in combination with very good HB pressure pre-claim.
Sub still looks good, seems like HB was annoyed at the early town consensus on them in a way that doesn't read teamed.
Beluga was getting stuck in with some good questions during the claim yesterday which I liked, want to see where they look today.
Skiff and Kayak I want to see more of now that there is some meat to the game can't really get a full read on either as of now.
Lifeboat feels like a trap to me, they were in very loud opposition to the momentum of the room in a way that stood out.
Duck was pinging me a bit yesterday, HBs defense was so poor so find it hard to believe there isn't a bus vote in there.
Gondola feels a bit more passive than I expected from their start, was around yesterday but not too invested.
too would also expect mafia to just vote on houseboat early and part of my read on why i think you could be mafia. But you put a spotlight on Duck for it with no self reflection of your own actions.
Did you consider that you did the exact same thing as them?
It feels like a weird thing for you to do as mafia. Which makes me think I am wrong and the mafia is in Beluga/inflatible/duck/gondola
I'm not even sure the worst thing was the frantic defence and the insistent fishing.
It was House standing down while Life was under scrutiny over what they said about House's claim yesterday.
That was post 666, checking the tool there had only been one vote at that point, on Lifeboat. If people might be talking themselves into a vote for the day you don't scupper that. You don't do that for someone who isn't a teammate.
Gondola meant (I'm guessing) HB standing down in relation to you saying they were 2 shot yesterday, so the person in danger would have been you, not them.
How is that standing down? They are insinuating that Houseboat did something to put themselves in the frame over me. I told people what happened and people generally came to conclusion I was telling the truth.
It makes no sense to make that connection. Houseboat was only in danger after Cruise Ship counter claimed. And no one had anything to do with that apart from Cruise Ship.
No, but you might have been. But instead at a time when people were looking at you as a possible option and while they still had goodwill they tried to share that goodwill with you instead of putting a boot in.
You have the events all out of whack and the mafia team had nothing to do with houseboat being in the frame. That was all Cruise Ship.
I think mafia are more likely to be the people who claim they never believed houseboat because they were aware that their claim was a lie and it would come back to bite them eventually. My position was that I believed Houseboat until Cruise Ship countered.
My ship, I think things are getting crossed here. *Here's what is being said:
Houseboat wasn't in danger at the time.
Houseboat posted they believed you to lessen pressure on you.
A lot of people came to the conclusion that you saying 2-shot was an honest mistake.
Gondala is saying that fake doctor scum houseboat clearing you at that time is weird.
My read on Houseboat being bad is certainly something to be looked at BUT I didn't know they were fake. Them tying themselves to me obviously makes me look bad but if they think they are eventually going to get busted with a counter claim they would be more likely to separate from partners than support them.
i guess if you think I am mafia they are doing it to stop two mafia going down which is fair but it just isn't like that.
But still Gondola is wrong and making a terrible read if they are say Houseboat stood down, i.e. gave themselves up to save me. Which is how I read their post. That is just not true.
Life was just blatantly misrepresenting what I was saying throughout all of that, which was quite simple: That scum!Houseboat had no reason to allow town!Lifeboat to escape the pressure they were under here, especially once people started tying their alignments together.
Cruise hadn't done anything at this point, it was early enough that any scrutiny they were facing here would have been cleared if ultimately town!Lifeboat flipped and it was all a misunderstanding. On the other hand scum!Lifeboat flipping would have given the game away.
Still trying to contort a read when something you thought was true actually wasn't. How about you say "hey I was wong, Lifeboat did talk about Houseboat" and reconsider some things instead of wasting everyone's time with a long post that is mostly incorrect
What do you mean direct with everyone else? You are getting confused because two different people are talking. I really didn't have much to say about Houseboat. I only questioned what people were thinking that questioning submarine was a mafia play. Because I thought that was a bad play to make as mafia (turns out it was). My partner is the one who says they are unsure then reads through and decides it is "damning".
Yes my read was bad. I wasn't the only one who gave Houseboat the benefit of the doubt. I am reading through some of the accusations against Houseboat.
Yours looks good, Duck looks good, Yacht looks good. I think Kayak's vote is good but i stand by that their reasoning felt a bit strained. That could be a bus vote.
Submarine called houseboat low hanging fruit but they also called the slip. Now maybe that came up in mafia chat and they highlighted it. Seems unlikely. And I think submarine has been very townie otherwie
So if i rule out inflatible, duck, yacht, kayak, submarine
then it is 2 of gondola, skiff, beluga.
now Beluga is interesting. They have a number of good posts but what is the towniest thing they have done? Beluga has the last vote on Houseboat before they claim. But it is a huge paragraph.
I'll be honest i didn't think it looked good for us after houseboat flipped mafia and i was really hoping for a cop check today. I was going to push on yacht but reading their interactions with houseboat makes them feel more town. So I am re-evaluating there. I am not sure they are on the right track with duck but they are digging into day 2 stuff that seems reasonable but ignores day 1 duck.
Outright says at the end of this that they hoped a cop checked them, which lends credence to the idea they were baiting that shit by being "too scummy to be scum" at EOD imo.
Also taking the chance to find a reason not to pursue Yacht yet again and point at someone else yet again despite continually returning to Yacht as a talking point they can't be arsed to chase.
I don't think that comment is sus tbh. I'm not 100% clearing yacht based on their interaction with houseboat i wanted other people to read and decide. My opinions have not been great so far.
I think you can read an element of fake frustration. But Yacht was a decently early vote on Houseboat. And did push on them a bit.
Can you clarify what you mean by had a "strong day" yesterday. There was a counter claim. Everyone thought Cruise ship was real. They didn't do anything that contributed to a mafia dying. Pre-counter claim they only had the accusation at me for a mis-read.
I think what i said about them being quick on Cruise Ship and Houseboat votes aligning shows they were already medic hunting because the mafia were trying to work it out after the Houseboat fake claim.
And accuses Beluga of medic hunting which feels like protection after their D2 day start post which I am going to quote again here because I want to damn it.
I tried to look at the reactions to the Doc claim during the night, but didn't really came to a solid conclusion.
Yachts stands out as one of the few that openly doubts the claim. I'd like to hear their thoughts now that we've had some time to let it simmer.
Yeah I think that is accurate for us. Kayak is second, but Gondola has more pair potential whereas I think Kayak is most likely to be teamed with Gondola. So Gondola first makes sense.
We need to be careful with the tallying, 2 of the votes are scum. I was wondering if having 10 votes from each half of a pair would help but the ratio of town to scum votes is the same so I am not sure. Right now I think Sub going to Gondola is the winning move.
Ok here is where i think we are. I see two worlds.
One it is Kayak and Beluga
The other it is Submarine and Yacht
Galleon is real imo. That seems fine to me. If it is inflatable then I have been got good.
The actual real messed up world is Beluga and Submarine are mafia together. I am more aware of that being a possible situation than kayak and yacht. SO for that means we need to kill one of Beluga or Submarine today.
Like this is the play that wins the game. I am prepared to lead on this.
i think Submarine is town here. The day 1 votes make no sense if submarine is mafia.
unless people think houseboat went out their way to try and undercut their team mate who was gathering a whole bunch of town reads early. Nah makes no sense.
And submarine has been trying to solve and providing logic for all their actions. But i though it was worth changing the focus at the start of the day to try and shake some more reads out.
For one thing Inflatible is NOT off the table.
Why isn't this a bus vote? Like they call out houseboat seeing that they are caught in the slip but they also throw out multiple names as potential alternatives.
I will need to speak with my partner when they get around but this half is comfortable with a Beluga vote. As for the second I think its between Kayak and Yacht but I don't have a real gut feeling either way. I can see links between Beluga and Yacht via Beluga's posts (I have not cross examined Yacht's yet) but so there is a notable and somewhat suspicious (to me) lack of interactions/comments/thoughts from Beluga on Kayak that might be a bit of distancing going on.
Unfortunately I don't see an agreement on LB. I was telling my partner in our chat that I may very well be wrong and I know going after a green check outside of a F3 is not the most optimal play but if I am going to be wrong I want to be wrong in something I fully believe in. I would much rather lose by casting a vote that I have confidence in rather than lose by casting a vote that I have reservations on.
Yeah, going back over this I think I'm pretty sold on Life as well.
My prime pick for scum team is Yacht/Lifeboat, more likely than Yacht/Sub imo.
The only thing that makes me hesistate is that Lifeboat came in wanting the Yacht vote today, but they're just so scummy. Did they think they could go for a fast hard bus today to look good being right and having whoever was left vote with them tomorrow once they're a "proven leader"?
Yacht/Lifeboat >> Yacht/Sub
As for the "others"
Life/Kayak... eeeeeeeeeeh.
Life's Kayak reads start off with this weird out of game lilt to them as if they couldn't find anything to scum read in their actual content and that's weird? Like, if you were shading a partner, you'd be able to find something right?
There was mention of that vote but I don't see it.
Honestly looking at the handful of interactions I noticed during my Life read I don't think this is it, even though the Life/Kayak LETS RUSH THIS SHIT double team at start of day made me think it might be,
Also the fact I just keep seeing endless fucking wiggling to avoid voting for Yacht makes me think Life/Yacht is more likely.
Kayak/Yacht I should probably look at just to make sure, I feel like I just accepted this was unlikely at some point but can't actually point to why.
Sub/Life doesn't work.
I don't need to look at interactions for that, if they were teamed they could have taken Kayak up on the vote Yacht proposition.
Also Sub looking into Life as an option today would be completely unnecessary if they were teamed, all they had to do was handwave and say green check. Nah, this isn't a team.
Sub/Kayak doesn't work because it might be shitty of me to say as it's not really game content but teammates don't go at each other hard enough to require multiple mod interjections.
Alas, Love is not something that you feel passion for…
You and another anonymous player have invaded the body of a costume account Yacht. You both will post in the game using this same account.
You are aligned with THE LOVELESS which means Scum.
Your shared role is Scum 1-shot strongman. Once during the game you may use night command STRONG KILL. This replaces the normal faction kill for the night. Strong kill will bypass any level of protection, and kills the target.
You can also use the faction’s night kill command KILL to remove a costume account from the game.
If your shared costume account dies during the game, both of you will be removed from the game.
You do not know who the other player controlling the account is. But you both share the same alignment and role.
You have access to the scum chat of THE LOVELESS located in Outer Mafia. You may only post in the chat using your costume account. The other player controlling your account will also post there using the same account.
You win the game, when members of THE LOVELESS control 50% of the vote and when all threats to THE LOVELESS are defeated.
Everyone have agreed on starting the day as soon as all night actions are in. So I will begin D6 as soon as it is so.
D6 will be shortened to be bit less than 24 hours long, assuming that night actions come in soon. I'll hash out the details once the night actions have been submitted.
I don't know what to really tell you. I thought their push on HB was consistent and town read them, with only doubt because of later votes keeping me from fully town reading them.
Also if I'm scum why would I go to such lengths to protect them when they have been a contender all game?
I don't know what to really tell you. I thought their push on HB was consistent and town read them, with only doubt because of later votes keeping me from fully town reading them.
Also if I'm scum why would I go to such lengths to protect them when they have been a contender all game?
I have been town reading you all game aside from the your protection of yacht. I'm not going to mess around too much. I am leaning Gondola as the final mafia.
I have been town reading you all game aside from the your protection of yacht. I'm not going to mess around too much. I am leaning Gondola as the final mafia.
If you think we were teamed with Yacht, I honestly have no idea what to tell you, I can't take that with a straight face. I've pushed for that slot for the last two days. I'm not sure which of you it is, my partner is pretty sure it's you. There's a heatwave going on and I'm melting here. That's what I've got here.
I have been town reading you all game aside from the your protection of yacht. I'm not going to mess around too much. I am leaning Gondola as the final mafia.
I have been town reading you all game aside from the your protection of yacht. I'm not going to mess around too much. I am leaning Gondola as the final mafia.
Ok here is where i think we are. I see two worlds.
One it is Kayak and Beluga
The other it is Submarine and Yacht
Galleon is real imo. That seems fine to me. If it is inflatable then I have been got good.
The actual real messed up world is Beluga and Submarine are mafia together. I am more aware of that being a possible situation than kayak and yacht. SO for that means we need to kill one of Beluga or Submarine today.
Like this is the play that wins the game. I am prepared to lead on this.
Gondola getting no movement from Yacht makes sense. By then Cruise was dead and they used the strongman early anyways, so it makes sense scum would have them sit tight just in case there was another investigator... Plus Yacht was massively pushing for Gondola yesterday and had most of the game.
Yacht pushed HB hard, but didn't always vote there and I don't see them pushing Gondola too, especially since Gondola cleared them with the claim.
You guys literally quoted my partner talking about my vote against Yacht on DAY 1.
Jet Ski doesn't flip or inflatible votes in a reasonable time and Yacht is dead on day 1. And another mafia has a medic claim that they know is going to fail.
LB did the vote switch and tried to get me to change my vote so Inflate could decide (while admitting they would have made us hammer if Inflate voted Yacht the very next day!)
and then on day 2 the massively went to bat for HB and tried to fish Cruise so hard so they would get checked. Since the check they were coasting and just relying on that and have had inconsistent reads all game.
Not to mention they claimed they town read Yacht because we do and scumread another player because we did even while saying we were still sus.
You guys literally quoted my partner talking about my vote against Yacht on DAY 1.
Jet Ski doesn't flip or inflatible votes in a reasonable time and Yacht is dead on day 1. And another mafia has a medic claim that they know is going to fail.
Gondola getting no movement from Yacht makes sense. By then Cruise was dead and they used the strongman early anyways, so it makes sense scum would have them sit tight just in case there was another investigator... Plus Yacht was massively pushing for Gondola yesterday and had most of the game.
Yacht pushed HB hard, but didn't always vote there and I don't see them pushing Gondola too, especially since Gondola cleared them with the claim.
Wouldn't Yacht be likely to be making a kill that night? They were under pressure and they might even have used the strong shot in case Yacht died the next day.
Wouldn't Yacht be likely to be making a kill that night? They were under pressure and they might even have used the strong shot in case Yacht died the next day.
I am town. Re-read the end of day 1 around me and yacht. I think you have been towny all game where as Gondola have been kind of up and down. My partner is suspect of Gondola too. I am putting it in your hands.
