Gossip Thread "And this one time, at Vamp Camp...."

Lol hi I’m just leaving work so will be able to go through all this when I get home. Wow you’re so thorough. My role name is Jack-of-all-Trades.

I’ll do proper quotes and stuff for everything when I get in. My department is moving office this week and this is the horrible internetless limbo stage
Okay I'm going to answer all your "easy" (straightforward) questions and then get back to you on the more complex stuff because I'm going through my notes and trying to find quotes to match stuff so here we go:

How many scum:
In a game of 23? Maybe 4 or 5? We know that LP was neutral so does that mean a lower scum number is more likely? We have 2 down already so it's seeming like there could be 2 or 3 more out there. I don't know if another neutral is likely. The only point of reference I have is Cluedo and it was 14 people - 3 scum/1 neutral/10 town.

When can I give block command:
It's a night action so I think I have to give the command on the night I want to use it. With research (check alignment) I did that on the night I wanted to use it.

Who would I have chatted to?
I was on the verge of chatting to Sawneeks but some RL stuff kept me busy around then so I didn't do it. I wanted to go for her because she was tunnelling so hard on me that I thought if I could get her on my side, I might manage to cope a bit better in the game. Plus, I'd been on her scumteam in Cluedo and she had been great and helpful and fun so I thought she would be a good ally again.

Harmony in S3?
Yeah, she got turned in the S3 finale but we didn't see her all vampy until S4. She's Cordelia's lapdog throughout the rest of S1-3.

Codewords and/or covert way of deciding on a block during day phase:
Yes please, that sounds awesome. I can't think of a way of doing that that isn't super suspicious but could be worth a try. Surely we'd need to assign top scum suspects a codeword/alias or something?

If we die do we need to prove this chat happened?
Yes, I think that would be helpful. I don't really know how it would be believable but we need to have something that backs up the other's alignment once one of us dies and flips Town. It helps confirm the other one.
Scum numbers: I'd say goon and odd night rb points to 5 because they are weaker. 6 does seem to much though, yeah.

Codeword: I put out my reads anyway, I'll just signal you two names who I'd block at night in a weird post. You could crumb your decision before night in case of unexpected deaths etc.
Ty and Include thing:

So I've had a proper read of D1 and here's my interpretation of things -

  • Include has a lengthy argument with Terra and Terra seems to be trying to brush it off most of the time.
  • Ty questions Include first. She hadn't mentioned him and he asks her about her Terra vote claiming that she must be voting Terra for more information because he'd done less than 10 posts at that point (#306, #311/#312).
  • Include argues that her posts (that big Reply to All one she did on Day 1 that targeted everyone who had mentioned her) have been answering questions, not accusations, which is what she said Terra's posts were and why she thought he seemed like scum (#316)
  • When Include eventually backed down a bit and said she would look at people other than Terra (still didn't remove her vote though), Ty seemed to suggest that this was some kind of fabrication.
  • At this point, Sorian popped up and attempted to discredit Include. He also dismissed anyone willing to give her brownie points and that he wasn't even reading her posts (#325)
  • When she decided that Saw might be neutral, Sorian was the one to post along the lines of "wtf is a noob talking about neutrals for?" (337)
  • I chimed in at this point, suggesting that maybe Include is one since that would give her knowledge of that. I also asked her who her scum were and she stuck with Terra and also said Fran (they'd had a bit of a row because she thought Fran was trying to defend Terra, which seemed more like a rule clarification from Fran, I think).
  • Sorian decides that a new player bringing up neutrals feels scummy
  • Ty disappears for a while and when he pops up again, he brings up Include again (#392) saying that her accusations feel forced
  • Terra then announces that Ty is his Towniest read so far (398) and throws shade at Include, yet votes Splinter. However, he also discusses Sorian in this post, claiming that he likes "some kinda fire coming from him".
Scum numbers: I'd say goon and odd night rb points to 5 because they are weaker. 6 does seem to much though, yeah.

Codeword: I put out my reads anyway, I'll just signal you two names who I'd block at night in a weird post. You could crumb your decision before night in case of unexpected deaths etc.
sounds like a plan
Basically, this all feels like Ty and Sorian defending Terra.

Ty frames it like he's trying to push Include into saying she voted Terra with some kind of plan in mind to get something out of him. Sorian dismisses all of this and doesn't directly reference her Terra vote or comments. Instead, just goes for putting her (and her posting style) down. Then the is Include neutral debate comes up but Sorian tries to push it as a scummy thing. Ty slips into the background for this as Sorian pushes this idea. Then Ty pops back up and says he still finds her scummy (although applauds her backing down on the Saw thing). Then Terra isn't so delicate and mentions both Ty and Sorian in a complimentary fashion in the same vote, while sassing Include yet voting Splinter
Blarg: I have no idea what he's up to. He did shit like this in Cluedo and he was Town. I don't know what Scum Blarg looks like but he's mad and unpredictable which almost becomes predictable in itself.
hahaha :D, I like this gif


This will come up randomly before the last 12 hours. I'll just say anything and make sure to only put in one or two living players, which would be my candidates to block at night.
That's interesting about D1. I didn't see the Ty and Sorian working her both angle so clearly. So you feel it's not scum Include faking this stand-off with Sorian and Ty?

What about this from D4? Ty's popping about as scum suspect from nearly everyone and he "randomly" decides to look into Include and come up with this story: 2619
So you're unsure about Blarg? Me too. I thought I saw the townie blarg during the day, but I'm not entirely sold. He could be faking it. However for now others have priority, I think.
Include was really quick out the gate on Day 1 but she's been shrinking day by day. She does these big huge posts that tend to be about one person, places a vote and then vanishes.

Also, whenever anyone questions her disappearing, she tends to get antsy about RL stuff. She had this odd thing with Brazil where she was convinced that he was making an attack on whatever her RL situation is.

She feels like someone who didn't realise how much of a commitment this is and regretted it by Day 2. She now just seems to be going through the motions. This is making me lean Town on her. Seeing LP flip neutral is making me doubt the whole "Is Include neutral debate".

I feel like a scumteam would have pushed her a little harder into playing or suggested she bow out and be replaced (although at one point - and I can't bloody find it now - she made a passing comment about nearly dropping out and then changing her mind). She's really volatile when pushed. I don't know if a scumteam would want to push a teammate like this in case she said something that would blow their cover.

Looking at this D1 thing seems more to me like they're trying to make her look bad. Sorian didn't like that people were looking favourably at her enthusiasm.

Just looked at the post you're referring to. The bits he's quoted are odd because sometimes the wider picture is contradicting what he's saying. In her breakdown of the rac votes, her conclusion stated that she didn't like the whole mad rush at deadline thing. However, he comments on her lack of being there at the vote due to timezones and states that her post about who to vote (Ty, LP and then votes melon) feels fabricated. Yet he says Town leaning and doesn't want to vote her. And the Sorian quote he uses is a reference to why is Include not on the Town leaders list (she was barely there when Fran made this list and he claimed it was meta leaders). The entire thing reeks of picking apart her posts but then going Town and when he is quizzed about it he compliments her posts. Weird.

Feels like bringing her up for the sake of bringing her up. Maybe to make people look to her?

They have a debate about whether or not Ty scumreads her (2623/2632) which he claims he doesn't but then asked you why you null read her. This proceeds in a circle. Not sure what he's playing at here. Was she up for any debate when he mentioned her? Seems a bit random.

Sorry, kept reading there. He really kept pushing for you to give a better explanation for null. Why???
I'm still looking at D3 votes and I think we have one more scum on Sorian. That means turmoil, Nicole or Flush. I'd suspect them in that order. Also one more at Flush, probably.
At the moment I'm swaying more towards turmoil. I'm rereading his D4 stuff now. I still think Terra was pretty sketchy on D1 and turmoil had to smooth some of that out but he's still not looking good

What do you think of Nicole's claim?
Rereading turmoil and he doesn't seem to actively talk to anybody. He also only answers the questions put to him that further whatever he's been saying up until then
So Terra seemed quite pro-Sorian and pro-Ty and turmoil comes in and scumreads both of these people. Seems a good way to distance himself from the Terra history they had.

The post he did (2771) about the early votes Terra made are kind of ridiculous by saying that Terra had never placed a vote on a confirmed Townie but none of them were confirmed scum and we now know that he voted for Splinter (twice) and I know that he had a vote on me so that's 2 Townies. Whereas turmoil's D3 votes are both confirmed scum (Sorian and Ty).

This doesn't make him look good. This makes him look terrible.
Include herself stated she underestimated the effort. She's clearly putting in a lot of time. She's a bit sensitive, but I can sympathize with her. RL is off-limits. Especially Ty attacking that issue, makes me townlean her more. And I hope she enjoys the game, even if she's scum, I like her style.

Maybe to make people look to her?
I believe that could be the point, yes. The whole post I linked seems fabricated and contradicting itself, like you said. Also he surely sensed that his time might be up soon, so he threw out some wifom food.

I'm saying Include is probably town.
She seems like she’s a bit fragile but when she’s here she tries hard. And I think Ty realised that she comments on every mention of her and this was an easy way to prod her a bit once people started pointing out that his townread looks a lot like a scumread
What do you think of Nicole's claim?
Can't wrap my head around it. Unfortunately we now have too many PRs in the open and that makes those who survive suspicious. She still didn't offer a character name, which should've been the first thing - but scum usually have fake claims, so maybe we shouldn't put too much value in it.

And we had a full grown doc. So if scum do not have an extra kill (like poison or vengeful or double) we only have the factional and my two shots. Does that warrant more defensive town roles? Mhm.

The problem is LP. Neutral. Yes, Nicole flipping and being scum would doom LP, but that could've been his way of informing scum of neutralness. His unvote showed that he didn't care about town's interest. Meh, Ty again:
I can't really figure out why he'd lie tho. We now know he probably made it to save himself, not Nicole, but why make that up apart from Nicole being one the leaders.
Grabbing townie points for being the first to answer or dismissing Nicole as scum?
This makes their early Terra defence thing look a lot more like a Terra defence than just trying to get more out of a new player (who was already giving plenty at that time)
I don’t know why she didn’t offer a character name when asked. If she has already claimed bulletproof (or something like it) then character would only help confirm this.
This doesn't make him look good. This makes him look terrible.
He's enjoying that nobody is paying attention to him. D3 he had the benefit of the doubt and D4 he never was going to be the topic. Yet at the day end there was a slight push.

Thanks for pointing out the distancing of Terra's positions. Terra was weirdly positive towards Sorian. I'm always remembering Brazil pointing out him being somewhat muted. Yeah, I agree that he's very suspect at the moment.

His attitude D4 would make me lean more to neutral, but who knows. Definitely doesn't feel like a townie.

What do you think of his vote for Sorian D3? He made Sorian the vote leader. Saying he'd rather vote Ty... damn.
claimed bulletproof (or something like it)
Commuter is also a possibility. She never clarified.

And I'm not sure if we should use fluff to verify her. In the end it's mafia and buffy just a theme, everyone should be able to play without knowledge.
The only other person I'm feeling a bit towny on is Flush. I think melon and Splinter pushed him the most and for not contributing mainly? I think? I might be a bit biased here.

There was literally no reason to vote Sorian when he did. But he also only sheeped my reasoning. Mhm.

He was a bit inactive, but always looked like he wanted to take part to me. I'm wary of his reasoning D4 though. Suspects and D3 Kyan and Splinter, obligatory Ty as a third, so he doesn't neglect him, but also does not have to go after him actively. Also saying "did not expect such a strong Sorian train" ... ? But it felt in line with his D3 behaviour.

Basically I think there can be made a good case against Flush, but my gut feeling still says town ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Forgot to find this for you: turmoil votes Ty: #1645.

I respond to this: #1731

Ty responds to my response (not turmoil’s vote): #1739

Nicole states she likes turnoil’s read: #1760

Ty responds to Nicole: 1767
I start work at 7 tomorrow (should hopefully finish early though) so I may need to get back to you on Royal tomorrow and with the reads list you requested
I start work at 7 tomorrow (should hopefully finish early though) so I may need to get back to you on Royal tomorrow and with the reads list you requested
Don't worry. I know I have way too much free time these days. I appreciate the time and effort you put into here! Thanks!

It would be already enough if you put the remaining players in order from towny to scummy, to have an idea where you are at.

And if you have any leads apart from what we discussed :)

Bonus question: if you had a vig shot, who would you shoot?
There are a couple of things I'd like to discuss this evening, just throwing it in here for now:

How many scum do you expect to be left alive?

What are your thoughts on Ty's interaction with Inlcude? They discussed during D1 and in this last phase Ty put out a read. What was his intention?

Turmoil ignored basically everything anyone asked him. He came in and only said votes look like this, so I vote x. Have you seen Beserk or Ted and Bill mafia? Do you see any reason for his behaviour?

What do you think of Blarg?

Basically I need your current thoughts on everyone alive minus these four: melon, Fran, GoG, Gorlak

Splinter lynch was far too easy and it was too quiet at the day end (before the claim).

From town to scum:

Between hom3land and Swamped I’m genuinely unsure. I think hom3land might be on the same boat as include. Newbie who didn’t anticipate the level of work so I’m starting to Town lean him. Dunno what to make of Blarg. And sometimes I really agree or really disagree with Swamped’s posts so I’m kind of lost on her. No idea what Nicole is doing. She’s all over the place. Flush I’m leaning scum but need to have a proper read because my thinking is mostly due to votes and I want to have a proper look at his posts.
Why are Brazil and Stan so high? Stan basically coasted all game and isn't looked at (well, melon did last day) He's detached.

And Brazil behaves similar as in Berserk (town), but I wasn't sure about him back then, because his posts are mostly NAI. Why is is so towny to you?
Saw asked if scum!hom3land was truly saved by Vere unvoting:

It's the same answer by accident. We know Sorian was on hom3, but Sorian likes bussing. Ty was already on gir. Points to one more scum already being on gir (swamped or nicole).

Looking at all days, I think at least one of Swamped and Stan is scum. They are often outside the main wagons (mostly because they are not around day end).

It might be necessary to resolve hom3land. He'd be more info flip than a genuine scum feeling on him. He probably won't be able to clear himself and he won't be nightkilled. He's a contender to go into endgame and I'm not sure I want that.

This makes me wonder, why didn't you check him? rac flipped town, you know yourself, why not look into the third contender d1? That's the best info you can get?!

We still have time 15 left, tomorrow 14 (barring multiple deaths)

If we assume 3 scum and maybe 1 neutral: 10-1-3 d5, 8-1-3 d6, 6-1-3 d7, 4-1-3 d8 (could be over) ... if scum have additional kills we face worse odds, +1nk 5-1-3 d7, +2nk 4-1-3 d7

So in the absolute worst case we could be game over d7 if neutral helps scum. I think it's reasonable to assume we have 3 lynches left to hit the next scum. Next night kills will most likely be melon, fran and maybe Nicole or me, whoever survives will be thrown shade at. (if no other pr comes forward)
reads town to scum
gorlak, fran, melon save as town
you - include very likely
flush - blarg
stan - swamped
nicole - turmoil
kyan - brazil
Looking at the end of D4. Out of the madness I can't read as much. The people who jump at you first are all town (fran, splinter, me) that maybe telling and I still can't completely discard you being scum. But obviously we can't read jumping onto you and back to Splinter if anyone is scum.

Voting Splinter was a no brainer after melon chimed in.

This means only the early votes on Splinter could be telling, because he was a safe town mislynch for scum. At least one scum would jump on that train early.
turmoil7 2408
Blargonaut 2411
Gorlak 2611 - town
SweetNicole 2829
hom3land 2865
Blargonaut 2951
Girlofgotham 2983 - town?

One or two scum. turmoil, blarg, nicole, hom3.

2803 Why does turmoil think Splinter flip gives lead towards Brazil/Flush, but not Kyan?
My strongest lead is the D1 votes on you. Between turmoil and Kyan is at least one scum, even if you are scum yourself. They are my top suspects.

Ah, and whenever you have sparetime I recommend Sophia's town guide, it's useful :)
Hi sorry long day. Work move is nearly done but I didn’t get any sleep last night with how sore I was after all the dragging boxes up to the new place.

Stan and Brazil are real middle of the road people for me. I mostly felt that the others below them on my list were scummier than they were. Not necessarily that they were showing particularly Townie qualities. I don’t remember much of Stan but I do find that Brazil’s posts are sometimes fairly good at picking things apart, granted he isn’t always around. I didn’t read Berserk Mafia so no idea how he played before.

I checked DCPat on N1 because he was my scummiest player all day until he claimed and I panicked and wanted to check and see if he was telling the truth. I messed up there. He came back Town and I was reading into the whole Sorian/Stan thing to make suggestions but then he went and died (which I still should have pursued on D2 but I panicked that I was a PR and scum had just killed one) At that point hom3land was only my second choice for a vote but I wanted to clear up the DC thing first. Plus with me up for the chop on the first night, this led to another panic and thus I decided I had to use something PR-wise in case I was still up for lynch D2. I messed it up majorly.

And thank you for the link to the article. I have had a skim of it and it’s a huge help. Will take the advice onboard.

Yeah turmoil is my biggest scum at the moment with Kyan close second. I am still to look at Sorian’s posts about Kyan that you suggested yesterday though.

I know that the D4 votes were intense. Again, I promise you that I’m Town. I know that there was a lot going on yesterday though and it’s tricky to get anything concrete out of the vote jumping because the Splinter claim/debunking sent everyone all over the place.

I agree that the hom3land question needs answered. I think he’s being kept alive because he’s an easy lynch to fall back on. In a way, I think that’s why I’m still here too. He feels like he’s just dipping in and out of things, which does feel like possibly inexperienced Town. However, when he does post, it tends to only be about the big topics. This could either be scum playing it safe or newbie Town who is missing the smaller things because he’s not reading everything. This might be my inexperience talking but why would it be a worry if he stayed around until nearer the end? An easy place for scum to hide because he can’t clear himself?
also I missed your earlier question, if I had 1 more vig kill shot I think turmoil is the best option.

Seems the most likely option as scum.

However, it would provide a way to resolve the hom3land situation but I think I’m really starting to lean Town on him.
Regarding Sorian - Kyan; it's not a lot of interaction.
First mention is this: #358 "Kyan trying to bait as well."

Than it takes until the town leader discussion, where Sorian lols at Kyan being an option (1570). He's named a few times, but Sorian keeps saying he doesn't matter in this discussion, while Fran thought sth. else (which I disagreed with, but maybe he tried to get info this way). Kyan asked for names of town leaders, Fran responded and Sorian went into his doom with weird arguments.

One more comment in #1718. "You want attention so bad don't you?"

The only direct response to a quote is #2045. Ty bussing in action and this weird statement about Royal forgetting that Vere was dead. Which I did not see at all and nobody else seemed to agree.

Sorian didn't go into a lot of people and doesn't have a lot of connections. 1718 looks like light shadethrowing at a teammate.

Can't make up my mind
Kyan talks about Sorian more often. And going through the posts I could see town Kyan in there, but same goes for scum Kyan. There was a discussion with hom3 D2, around 1330 about sorian meta, but it's not very helpful.

And his defense yesterday seemed a bit desperate, asking me for his strategy... saying he tried to save Sorian and then threw shade at Ty over two day phases, which is just untrue.
why would it be a worry if he stayed around until nearer the end?
Too much wifom, he's been suspicious since the start, a big question mark. I know that I don't want the final decision to be between him and someone else (say swamped or stan). Even with more flips, the votes will not clear him either. It's just a situation I'd like to avoid if possible.
Hey, it was amazing to work with you. I didn't expect to put in so much work this night phase, because there is a chance I die. I found it quite productive and hope we can catch scum together.

Fluff points to you being town, but I'm still not entirely convinced. Your behaviour was mostly townie, however two or three small questions bugged me.

That's why I chose to withhold talking about someone possibly being a town PR, which would also jumble my reads a bit. But you didn't seem to notice that person, so there is a chance scum didn't either. Couldn't give it away, sorry. (though if I feel convinced, I'll signal you the "ally")

I thought of something you can give into the thread to confirm I was here... facts:

Flush and I want to meet irl this year
I wrote turmoil a dm on discord at the 20.01
Blarg maybe won't remember, but I sent him a pm during his thunderdome in cthulhu (this was before I joined our community)

If you need to claim, do it with enough time for others to think about it, 24 hours is good for example. Keep in mind to do a full claim and don't forget anything. If you do it piece by piece with too much time in between or if people need to ask for specific details, they will be less inclined to believe you. Character, role name, commands, night actions, reasons. Answer truthfully and don't get overly defensive. Some will believe, some won't.
When people made up their minds about you, try to give your reads and tell why your suspect should be lynched. Just do your best, I believe in you :)

As for backing you up, I can go as far as confirming the gossip and what you said here.


Thank you for inviting me! Looking forward to play with you anytime. It was a real pleasure <3
Thank you so much. You’re so thorough and your advice has been v welcome both for this game and playing in general (since this is only my second game. I want to play plenty more so the hints and tips go a long way.

I entirely understand you being apprehensive about giving things away too easily. I’ll keep an eye out on the future for any clues and whatnot.

Stay safe out there :P



Lord of Volcano Island
Is the title of this thread not a clue as to Gotham's in-game character? :P

(It's the same actress right?)
Top Bottom