Scum Thread Evil League

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
It’s a role I could see Geno doing. Also there have to be numerous neutrals still alive because otherwise town is way too fucking stacked.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
It’s a role I could see Geno doing. Also there have to be numerous neutrals still alive because otherwise town is way too fucking stacked.
Definitely seeing that. I’m not totally sure about the spreading fire, that might be one of the neutrals; the one who caused nin and Reki to fight, too.
 

Hawthorn

I'll explain my reasons later
More power to you if you can do it!

Not so sure that TP is an investigator, I guess we can deal with it if it happens. I think maybe the best plan would be for one of us to counterclaim TP or otherwise discredit him, rather than come up with a reason for Natiko to have visited Kopite, if we go that way.

I feel like all the false reasoning in the thread has made it difficult for me to come up with real theories about what's actually happening, I just have no idea at all.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Nah no one should stick their neck out for me if I’m had. Not worth it.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
I’m hoping people put up a good argument for you and I can completely back off the bus. Going to try and make it more natural though
 

Hawthorn

I'll explain my reasons later
I took too long to get caught up and now I'm not going to post anything substantive tonight, good thing I already made more than 10 posts.

I felt really guilty when I read Reki's post about why they town read me!

Would't TP have revealed himself by now if he had a smoking gun?
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
I took too long to get caught up and now I'm not going to post anything substantive tonight, good thing I already made more than 10 posts.

I felt really guilty when I read Reki's post about why they town read me!

Would't TP have revealed himself by now if he had a smoking gun?
Reki’s posts are very, very good. They could catch on to any one of us, honestly.

Yeah, I don’t think TP is sure. He may not even actually have anything, but he’s the only person who’s suspicious of Natiko which is alarming. Based on what we know, he might be working with a tracker read and coming to a conclusion based on how many town PRs. At worst, he might be an alignment cop with a red check on Natiko and he’s breadcrumbing so he doesn’t have to role claim before he’s out of shots. I had considered that TP might have that role, and i didn’t mention it, but it was a small part of why I decided to attack Blarg in case I have to be on the same continent as one of his territories for him to check me.

also, Natiko has set me up to look like a total dipshit and I am going to take the opportunity to slam dunk that tomorrow morning. Trying to space out my posts to give the impression I’m dejected after what happened.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Reki’s posts are very, very good. They could catch on to any one of us, honestly.

Yeah, I don’t think TP is sure. He may not even actually have anything, but he’s the only person who’s suspicious of Natiko which is alarming. Based on what we know, he might be working with a tracker read and coming to a conclusion based on how many town PRs. At worst, he might be an alignment cop with a red check on Natiko and he’s breadcrumbing so he doesn’t have to role claim before he’s out of shots. I had considered that TP might have that role, and i didn’t mention it, but it was a small part of why I decided to attack Blarg in case I have to be on the same continent as one of his territories for him to check me.

also, Natiko has set me up to look like a total dipshit and I am going to take the opportunity to slam dunk that tomorrow morning. Trying to space out my posts to give the impression I’m dejected after what happened.
I think you’re in a pretty good spot so just keep at it. TP is next to me so if he doesn’t reveal maybe I’ll just kill him tomorrow night. At the same time though there’s eight thousand protection roles apparently so idk.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
I think you’re in a pretty good spot so just keep at it. TP is next to me so if he doesn’t reveal maybe I’ll just kill him tomorrow night. At the same time though there’s eight thousand protection roles apparently so idk.
I have no idea what to do about all the protection. How do you even start to deal with that lol
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
We’re going to need to consolidate around some counter trains here. I think Uzzy and Ynnek might be where town is headed.
 

Hawthorn

I'll explain my reasons later
If he hasn't come out with it yet today, he's not going to. We can kill him tonight, if he's not one of the 90% of players who will protected/switched
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
If he hasn't come out with it yet today, he's not going to. We can kill him tonight, if he's not one of the 90% of players who will protected/switched
That’s what I’m afraid of. There’s so much unpredictability with the switches and doctors, I don’t know if we’ll necessarily get away with it. I think we need to plan around that possibility. If we lose me today and Natiko tomorrow, we’re going to be in a bad spot.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
Even killing TP puts us in a bad spot if he flips and then suddenly people realize he had Natiko on his scum list.
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Doesn't matter at that point, at least we minimized the future damage he can do.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
The only way to guarantee TP’s death seems to be Stan’s strong kill stack with the long range kill, unless we roll the (figurative) dice that he doesn’t get protected tonight. What do you all think?

Kopite did not mention protecting TP, so I can’t even say maybe he can’t protect the same territories twice in a row. :(
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
I think it depends on if he claims. I don't think he's widely townread by any means currently.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
I think it depends on if he claims. I don't think he's widely townread by any means currently.
It would only take one of Jman or Kopite, and I don’t think either one is going to post a reads list before day end because it would tip their hands for planned actions.
 

Stantastic

Our Badminton Stanpion
Okay i need to sleep soon and im concerned about what to do with my vote and i need some second opinions.
Iv been pushing Launch pretty hard, but i dont want to vote there as it actually feels like a possibility today, but i feel like if i dont and you get lunched anyway then that might look real suspect on me tomorrow.

wat do?
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
Okay i need to sleep soon and im concerned about what to do with my vote and i need some second opinions.
Iv been pushing Launch pretty hard, but i dont want to vote there as it actually feels like a possibility today, but i feel like if i dont and you get lunched anyway then that might look real suspect on me tomorrow.

wat do?
I think without Terra/Natiko/you voting me, there’s little chance I get lynched today. I think TP and Uzzy are the only one who still believe I might be scum. If there’s anyone you can make a solid case for then bug out, that would be ideal. Ynnek seems pretty well set up for you, based on your last post.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
Say something like “there doesn’t seem to be enough support for launch lunch, so I’m going to leave my vote on X”
 

Stantastic

Our Badminton Stanpion
I think without Terra/Natiko/you voting me, there’s little chance I get lynched today. I think TP and Uzzy are the only one who still believe I might be scum. If there’s anyone you can make a solid case for then bug out, that would be ideal. Ynnek seems pretty well set up for you, based on your last post.
Ehh i think thats too little on Ynnek, but i given my arguing i can probably make Terable work.
 

Hawthorn

I'll explain my reasons later
Okay i need to sleep soon and im concerned about what to do with my vote and i need some second opinions.
Iv been pushing Launch pretty hard, but i dont want to vote there as it actually feels like a possibility today, but i feel like if i dont and you get lunched anyway then that might look real suspect on me tomorrow.

wat do?

Sorry I missed this (at work) but agree your vote looks good to me!

I lucked out with the Uzzy vote, now it looks super reasonable XD
 

Hawthorn

I'll explain my reasons later
Personally I think we could roll the dice (figuratively) on killing TP with just the normal faction kill, but it depends on how the day plays out
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
We absolutely don't use the long range kill/strong kill on him. Assuming he doesn't reveal today, we either direct kill him via me or I block him and we kill someone else. Hitting the doctors is going to be hard as fuck with TWO doctors AND a switcher though. Or we could block Jman, strong kill a doctor. Sucks to use a strong, distance kill on a player next to one of us though.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
We absolutely don't use the long range kill/strong kill on him. Assuming he doesn't reveal today, we either direct kill him via me or I block him and we kill someone else. Hitting the doctors is going to be hard as fuck with TWO doctors AND a switcher though. Or we could block Jman, strong kill a doctor. Sucks to use a strong, distance kill on a player next to one of us though.
Let’s throw out a few scenarios after day end and see what seems like the best way forward. I think there are a few options, but there is definitely no perfect action here.
 
I have class and work back to back, so i wont be around much EoD. If Launch can live to see another day idk what to think about town lol
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Lol that timing. Have fun guys. Maybe long range strong kill him after all if he doesn’t claim (which he likely won’t have to after ending me)
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
Geno there better be eight neutrals and a second scum team to explain why we weak as fuck lol
 

Natiko

Town's Friendly Neighborhood Serial Killer
No worries, cops are just an inherently not fun role to play against. Good luck killing the cop and multiple doctors with a switcher and them protecting each other, plus who knows what else. I’ll be rooting for you in spec. Be bold, I think it’s your only shot at winning.
 
Sorry for giving them extension, it's not fair for you but I happen to be liteeally fucked every day end and the tool always breaks always near day end.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
Sorry for giving them extension, it's not fair for you but I happen to be liteeally fucked every day end and the tool always breaks always near day end.
Don't worry about it, honestly. The extension saved me ass last phase. It cuts both ways lol
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
So like I said, I would not trust Jman or Kopite, especially Jman, he's known for misdirects. If anything, I think he wants us to burn a potential strongman on Kopite. Plus, I do not believe Kopite self-protected last night; Indonesia would have been protected from an attack if he had and my unit in Indonesia wouldn't have been wiped. This is a real shot in the dark, but I think Kopite asking Jman if he can target the same people twice means that Kopite cannot. Either way, I would let them burn out their shots and leave that clusterfuck be for now. At most, I would recommend Hawthron investigate Kopite to see how many shots he has left.

I'm going to list everyone out and we can figure out how to get the best choices done after.

Players to avoid killing because they are good targets for protection/fuckery:
  • Jman
  • Kopite
  • Kalor
  • TearablePuns
  • wee
  • Zipped
Good lower key targets based on how they're being read:
  • Kyranrute (with the big added bonus of me getting access to China)
  • LP
  • Reki
Not great targets based on how they're being read
  • Uzzy
  • Kawl
  • SalvaPot
  • Verelios
  • Fran
  • Ynnek7
  • nin
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
I think we might need to blow Stan's abilities tonight. There's just too high a probability Kopite will protect someone we hit and we need a kill tonight. We know Kopite and wee are going to be out of shots soon, so having a strongman is going to be useless after that point. Now is the time to use them. It's just unfortunate Stan isn't next to anyone worth killing. I've been staring at this map for like 20 minutes trying to see if there's any normal Faction Kill that will go through, and Fran and Verelios are the only ones and they're not very good targets. And if we're going to use the universal kill, might as well make it count.

I can't show up without a trap down at day start, or else someone is going to call bullshit on me again.

Terra is actually one of our strongest roles from a Risk perspective, too, and he's only one off from his bonus territory. The people who did night attacks did not get chastised, and Terra can just come in saying he suspects Vere after reading the day end shenanigans.

Then Hawthorn can try to find out how many shots Kopite has so we can start killing normally, or how many shots Jman has (because I think he generally feeds the game bad information).

Here's a suggested series of actions to throw darts at:

Hawthorne: Investigate, Kopite/Jman
Launchpad: Trap, Indonesia
Stan: Strongman Universal Kill, Kyanrute/Kopite (China/Western Australia)
Terra: Regular Attack, Japan
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
Feels like we've been threading a needle this whole game, but it just feels like it's triplicating every phase lol
 

Hawthorn

I'll explain my reasons later
I agree about now being the time to use the universal kill, and that the "no unilateral attacks" standard has broken down enough that attacking will be considered normal, as was pretty much inevitable.

I think we should use the strong kill to take out one of the protective roles-- yes they might be out of shots soon, but basically we can't do anything with all of them around. The switch also might affect my investigation. IMO we should use the strongman universal kill on Jman and I should keep my intestigation for tomorrow, since jman will likely switch Kopite. Or, I'm ok with using the investigation with this plan if necessary, at least we'll get results on someone, even if it's not the person I investigated. I picked jman because I think the switch might have higher priority than the strong kill, but the protective roles will not.

Of the people you mentioned as good lower key targets, I'm not into LP because I think he'll be voted out eventually. OK with Kyanrute or Reki, like the idea of getting China especially if you can hold onto it for a while, we really need to broaden our kill base. But my preference would be jman and to save the investigation.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
I agree about now being the time to use the universal kill, and that the "no unilateral attacks" standard has broken down enough that attacking will be considered normal, as was pretty much inevitable.

I think we should use the strong kill to take out one of the protective roles-- yes they might be out of shots soon, but basically we can't do anything with all of them around. The switch also might affect my investigation. IMO we should use the strongman universal kill on Jman and I should keep my intestigation for tomorrow, since jman will likely switch Kopite. Or, I'm ok with using the investigation with this plan if necessary, at least we'll get results on someone, even if it's not the person I investigated. I picked jman because I think the switch might have higher priority than the strong kill, but the protective roles will not.

Of the people you mentioned as good lower key targets, I'm not into LP because I think he'll be voted out eventually. OK with Kyanrute or Reki, like the idea of getting China especially if you can hold onto it for a while, we really need to broaden our kill base. But my preference would be jman and to save the investigation.
That’s a really good point about Jman. I think Jman is a good choice as well. His switch targets might be out of left field from what he mentioned, but he would not have coordinated with Kopite to get protection if he was planning to switch himself. That would be too 5D chess.

While Kopite is in the pool of players i don’t want to mess around with due to switching shenanigans, given the amount of roleclaims out in the open already, we’ve sussed out most of the important ones. The ones that are left are likely like the dice improver thing Hedin had. It’s worth the risk of getting redirected to know how many shots Kopite has left so we know when we can safely kill normally again. Hell, if we find out he was 2 shot, then we don’t have to kill him anymore. He will have not have proven he has that role and people will be suspicious of him over time when he is still alive so far into the game.
 

Hawthorn

I'll explain my reasons later
OK, so the tentative plan would be:

Hawthorn: Investigate, Kopite
Launchpad: Trap, Indonesia
Stan: Strongman Universal Kill, Jman (Kamchatka)
Terra: Regular Attack, Japan

What's the trap in Indonesia for BTW? Is the test the traps plan still on?

I do want to hear what Terra and Stan think, but tentatively in favor of the above so far.

In terms of what to talk about tomorrow, I'm thinking of staying on Uzzy as her "let's you and him fight" role sounds not very town-oriented. That way I won't have to join any busses, enough of those going around anyway.
 
Whew go team. Sorry I missed so much of the end. Hopefully I'll be able to catch up in what I missed before tomorrow.

I'm fine with attacking Vere since it sounds like he did some weird shit at the end anyway. Personally I think Stan should strongman Kyan. He's one of the more vocal town players, and Jman is already on the verge of death especially with Fanto playing. Plus China. I wouldn't mind Kopite, although to a lesser extent since he's not much of a variable as far as people who can guide the train of thought of town.

But Jman wouldn't be a bad choice even if he isn't my preferred one, so take your pick.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
Terra, you have a good point about Jman being close to getting wiped out. Him and Vere went hard on the dinosaurs. Fanto’s going to be there at minute 0 to continue the attack, and Terra attacking Jman’s ally and reducing the number of spaces to run to is going to screw him a bit. I don’t think it’ll happen tomorrow unless Terra and wee press the advantage and stick it to Jman/Vere, but things might just naturally go that way.
Would like to hear from Stan, yes.
 

Stantastic

Our Badminton Stanpion
Whats up, i exists.
I agree that i should use my shit, and that kyan makes an effective and likely unobstructed target
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
Ok, Kyan seems to be the consensus. I figure I’d ask @Geno in case it changes the calculus for anyone, can the Universal Kill be used on the same night as a Faction Kill?
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
So I’m going to throw out another option here:


Hawthorne: Investigate, Kopite
Launchpad: Trap, Indonesia
Stan: Strongman Universal Kill, China
Terra: Faction Kill, Japan

Vere isn’t the best kill from a mafia perspective, but if we are getting two kills, might as well make the most of it, and it has the Risk advantage that Fanto might be able to kill Jman then.
 
Just went ahead with it since Geno said we can't do both anyway. Now Stan can go ahead and strongman Kyan to death and whatever else (obviously Launch with his trap and Hawth scanning Kopite is fine).
 
Also Nat is right. I hope there's at least 2-3 more third parties to mix things up. Right now we feel pretty weak power-wise. I'm surprised we didn't at least have a second kill option. I'm assuming part of the balance is just due to Geno factoring in potential aggressiveness of players, but we still feel damn weak. Even if we manage to get a third mislynch/fourth non-scum lynch (not to mention the two daytime town kills) we still could have a ways to go.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
Also Nat is right. I hope there's at least 2-3 more third parties to mix things up. Right now we feel pretty weak power-wise. I'm surprised we didn't at least have a second kill option. I'm assuming part of the balance is just due to Geno factoring in potential aggressiveness of players, but we still feel damn weak. Even if we manage to get a third mislynch/fourth non-scum lynch (not to mention the two daytime town kills) we still could have a ways to go.
yeah, that stuck out in my mind when Uzzy was in the lead there that maybe she was one of the neutral and I tried to back off even though the reason wasn’t the best. I also think it’s strange she used her ability on Nin/Reki because they were “getting too cozy” when I’ve been her alleged top scum read all game. I’d like to protect any potential neutrals for as long as possible now, especially those a bad exchange away from getting lynched lol

It’s going to be rough, anyway. Hopefully Fanto pulls through for us.
 
Dammit, Geno, get it together! :P

All good, then. Let’s do the thing.

TRAP: Indonesia
My bad, thought you were asking if you can use the universal kill as a faction kill, and I was like that's what it was lol.
So I'm going to go ahead and attack then.

Blitz: Japan, Mongolia
You lose a roll, then Vere, then you then Vere and then take over Japan, how many battalions do you put in? Note that if you get roleblocked or switched or anything similar in nature the attack will be cancelled.
 
yeah, that stuck out in my mind when Uzzy was in the lead there that maybe she was one of the neutral and I tried to back off even though the reason wasn’t the best. I also think it’s strange she used her ability on Nin/Reki because they were “getting too cozy” when I’ve been her alleged top scum read all game. I’d like to protect any potential neutrals for as long as possible now, especially those a bad exchange away from getting lynched lol

It’s going to be rough, anyway. Hopefully Fanto pulls through for us.
Yeah we need that Fanto carry hard lol. I'm guessing her goal is to destroy a certain amount of territories, so she might go for LP next, but I sure hope she finishes off Jman in NA at some point. If not more beyond that.

My bad, thought you were asking if you can use the universal kill as a faction kill, and I was like that's what it was lol.

You lose a roll, then Vere, then you then Vere and then take over Japan, how many battalions do you put in? Note that if you get roleblocked or switched or anything similar in nature the attack will be cancelled.
Just move three, and leave my general in Mongolia.
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
My bad, thought you were asking if you can use the universal kill as a faction kill, and I was like that's what it was lol.

You lose a roll, then Vere, then you then Vere and then take over Japan, how many battalions do you put in? Note that if you get roleblocked or switched or anything similar in nature the attack will be cancelled.
RIP if Jman decided Vere was a good person to swap Tearable with
 

Stantastic

Our Badminton Stanpion
oh yeah you literally said as much.
im sorry im fuckin dead today, honestly real lucky its night phase atm, i am bloody youhselease.

Universal Kill: Kyanrute
Strongman
 

Hawthorn

I'll explain my reasons later
rolecop: Eastern Australia

I'm ok with this plan, we're limited in what we can do right now, but we're doing our best.

Stan, IMO, we sadly have to use the strong kill, there are too many protective roles active.

There's also the matter of puppetmon's possible attack, if you give me a moment I will look at the map and think about possibilities.

Really good point everyone had about trying to protect neutrals for now. I'll try to back off Uzzy in case she is one, and will be rooting for the dinos
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
oh yeah you literally said as much.
im sorry im fuckin dead today, honestly real lucky its night phase atm, i am bloody youhselease.

Universal Kill: Kyanrute
Strongman
it’s all good man. I think the command is good if it’s good with Geno

rolecop: Eastern Australia

I'm ok with this plan, we're limited in what we can do right now, but we're doing our best.

Stan, IMO, we sadly have to use the strong kill, there are too many protective roles active.

There's also the matter of puppetmon's possible attack, if you give me a moment I will look at the map and think about possibilities.

Really good point everyone had about trying to protect neutrals for now. I'll try to back off Uzzy in case she is one, and will be rooting for the dinos
I was actually planning on attacking Puppetmon first and taking China, feigning that I’m trying to preempt it attacking one of us. I should have enough battalions, but it’s still going to be a close win.
 

Hawthorn

I'll explain my reasons later
I looked at the map, and I really tend to think we should have puppetmon attack Fran. He has only two troops and a general in India, there's a stong possibility that we could actually kill him. If we get the command in right at the start of the attacking period, Launchpad can swoop in and attack puppetmon right after puppetmon's attack stops, still getting China. I don't think it'll seem suspicious to attack puppetmon, if he wasn't seen as a bad guy before, it's clear from how puppetmon attacked Blarg, now known to be a town player. We have very few attacks we can actually use, I think we should use them all.
 

Hawthorn

I'll explain my reasons later
Also puppetmon might be weakened in the attack on Fran, softening him up for a weak defense to Launchpad's attack
 

LaunchpadMcQ

...can I smell you?
We will put the Puppetmon attack command in here first, but I will act like I was trying to attack preemptively in the thread and put my command in a few seconds after. It’ll help my towncred that I didn’t know Puppetmon was attacking when I put in the command, only to have Puppetmon’s attack get priority.
 
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