RPG Mafia - Secret Chrono Fantasy Trail CIXVI

The Wizard

Confidently Incorrect
Seems like everyone skipped over the post where I gave what I assume is a vest to melon.

I could go Sorian here, of the louder folk it seems like he is solving the least imo
 

Sorian

Neutral Ascetic 1-Shot BP SK Alignment Cop
Staff member
I find it kind of weird that Fran let Turmoil claim he visited Zipped first. I guess on a re-read it's whatever but I found it weirder the first time I read it. Now I guess I see it though the breadcrumb post Fran points to isn't really a breadcrumb. I feel like it's crazy to assume some scum team shenanigans openly like this so I'm not but I read it again and it still gave me a reaction.

Seems like everyone skipped over the post where I gave what I assume is a vest to melon.

I could go Sorian here, of the louder folk it seems like he is solving the least imo

Look, this is to you and also to Turmoil (and maybe Ty, I forget what Ty said about his vote). I appreciate the vote of confidence that people assume I am some masterful mafia player but we've been down this road a million times. I am a barely above average solver, any type of legacy I have in your minds is from my scum play not my town play. I'm not sure what you are expecting from me but I've been trying to solve plenty. And to Turm, since you want to shade my "bad" vote record, by all means, show me who has a good vote record in your opinion. We are on day 4 and a full vote was used up on a red check. You can just admit you are mad that I voted you day 1 when you seem to have been barely playing that day because you didn't have a role yet.
 

nin1000

Chilean German Madman
This is my actual third thing, I don't think it's fair that I didn't answer this in the moment because now there is so much new information but if I had answered at the time, I don't think my answer would have been wildly different. I would have said Muffin or Geno today and Turm as a distant possibility. Now that said, and this is shade at Turmoil tbh, I already said I had cooled on wanting to vote out Turm so I find it funny that he is making his vote for me about himself as if he's a big piece of my radar anymore but whatever.

Obviously with the new posts from today, Turm has dropped down to like 0 for me (I forgot to say in the last post, if you are going to counter claim Turmoil, you absolutely should just come out with it, even if you have more doctor shots or whatever, going 1:1 with a scum fake claim is always worth it).

So, I'm between Muffin and Geno, socially I vote Muffin here but Geno's tunnel has went on longer than I would have expected considering we've SEEN a scum flip now. @nin1000 did you ever confirm the gossip chat with Muffin? Would be a wild thing to lie about but I want to verify.

I was indeed in a chat with muffin this last night phase
 

turmoil7

Imperial Corps Commander Who Cheers the Army
I gave melon chainmail last night so that was my assumption coming into day on what stopped the night kill but now with turms I’m not sure.
Sorry I completely missed this the first time.........

Yeah melon was being widely town read, she was a probable target last night. Damn I was sure I stopped a NK :(
 

turmoil7

Imperial Corps Commander Who Cheers the Army
Sorian I think you are a fallible human being as any other. Sorry if something comes as abrasive.
 

Sorian

Neutral Ascetic 1-Shot BP SK Alignment Cop
Staff member
.....I missed that post too and I read back through twice. Well now that makes this less of a slam dunk. Was melon being widely town read though? I guess there was enough town sentiment but definitely not at Zipped's level.
 

The Wizard

Confidently Incorrect
Look, this is to you and also to Turmoil (and maybe Ty, I forget what Ty said about his vote). I appreciate the vote of confidence that people assume I am some masterful mafia player but we've been down this road a million times. I am a barely above average solver, any type of legacy I have in your minds is from my scum play not my town play. I'm not sure what you are expecting from me but I've been trying to solve plenty.
I don’t have a ton of games with you but I remember one game where you were town and you were very opinionated on your scum reads even when they were wrong. I’m not trying to say you should have single handedly flipped scum here, more just I want to get the sense that you care about what you’re saying.
Sorry if it feels like an unfair meta read.
.....I missed that post too and I read back through twice. Well now that makes this less of a slam dunk. Was melon being widely town read though? I guess there was enough town sentiment but definitely not at Zipped's level.
FWIW I did consider just giving it to Zipped but figured scum have some way to circumvent it (a strong kill seems likely with what we’ve seen so far)
I also wanted to be a bit greedy in the skipped kill acting as a soft green check vs Zipped who I think is already just green
 
Chuggs: Vendor
Muffin: Gossip
Ael: Gossip?
Geno: Something
Zipped: Check at Lvl 2 (I forget what this is called)
Turm: Trainee
Fran: Track shot (forgot about this)
Nin: Mayor
Wizard: gave chainmail
 

Franconp

Frank
I find it kind of weird that Fran let Turmoil claim he visited Zipped first. I guess on a re-read it's whatever but I found it weirder the first time I read it. Now I guess I see it though the breadcrumb post Fran points to isn't really a breadcrumb. I feel like it's crazy to assume some scum team shenanigans openly like this so I'm not but I read it again and it still gave me a reaction.

Honestly I wasn't expecting Turm to claim. I was mostly waiting for Zipped. Maybe he got something last night and it could be solved without a claim.
 

turmoil7

Imperial Corps Commander Who Cheers the Army
I believe Wiz's claim, with only 1 doctor shot and 1 bodyguard shot it makes sense there is another protective role.

Now, wouldn't commuter be considered a protective role too? Would it be bypassed by a strong kill in a normal game?

.....
Protective roles:

1 doctor shot
1 bodyguard shot
X chainmail-giver shots
X(3? %commuter shots)*

Dunno, does this seems balanced to people?

I'm leaning towards yes, assuming scum has 1 or 2 strong kills

* A townie commuter can have negative utility if used when investigated by town
 
Chuggs: Vendor
Muffin: Gossip
Ael: Gossip?
Geno: Something
Zipped: Check at Lvl 2 (I forget what this is called)
Turm: Trainee
Fran: Track shot (forgot about this)
Nin: Mayor
Wizard: gave chainmail
Ty: Commuter
 

Franconp

Frank
Chuggs: Vendor
Muffin: Gossip
Ael: Gossip?
Geno: Something
Zipped: Check at Lvl 2 (I forget what this is called)
Turm: Trainee
Fran: Track shot (forgot about this)
Nin: Mayor
Wizard: gave chainmail
Ty: Commuter

Alexem claimed a lie detector.

Sorry that I'm sharing this in small doses. but I'm doing the same thing and this game has a lot of info to look for.
 
Chuggs: Vendor
Muffin: Gossip
Ael: Gossip?
Geno: Something
Zipped: Check at Lvl 2 (I forget what this is called)
Turm: Trainee
Fran: Track shot (forgot about this)
Nin: Mayor
Wizard: gave chainmail
Ty: Commuter
Alexem: Lie detector

@Franconp can you requote where they claimed that?
 
Chuggs: Vendor
Muffin: Gossip
Ael: Gossip?
Geno: Something
Zipped: Check at Lvl 2 (I forget what this is called)
Turm: Trainee
Fran: Track shot (forgot about this)
Nin: Mayor, double vote
Wizard: gave chainmail
Ty: Commuter
Alexem: Lie detector (came back true)
 

Hedin

Oops, All Scum!
Staff member
==== DAY 4 VOTES ====
Day Start

Chuggernaut (3 votes)
Aeleus - #2,420
nin1000 - #2,519 #2,671
Franconp - #2,597
Natiko - #2,650 #2,669
Chuggernaut - #2,662

turmoil7 (3 votes)
TheWorthyEdge - #2,408
Zippedpinhead - #2,635
nin1000 - #2,671

Sorian (2 votes)
turmoil7 - #2,600
Ty4on - #2,603

Geno (2 votes)
The Wizard - #2,424
Sorian - #2,700

Ty4on (1 votes)
Geno - #2,391

Franconp (0 votes)
Chuggernaut - #2,548 #2,662

Not voting: Alexem, Natiko, Muffin, melonrabbit

Post Counts:
Chuggernaut: 70 TheWorthyEdge: 56 Franconp: 42 Geno: 38 Sorian: 27 melonrabbit: 27 nin1000: 26 Ty4on: 23 The Wizard: 23 Zippedpinhead: 23 turmoil7: 20 Aeleus: 19 Muffin: 17 Alexem: 13 Natiko: 7

Current Countdown:
oxl6c09om3



Click here to go to the Vote Tool!
 

turmoil7

Imperial Corps Commander Who Cheers the Army
Scum for sure must have a list of fakeclaims, right? I don't see other way for them to have a fair chance with this soup of PRs we have currently claimed.
 
Honestly I wasn't expecting Turm to claim. I was mostly waiting for Zipped. Maybe he got something last night and it could be solved without a claim.
I got nothing last night, but I also did not use a skill last night (wether I learned my level 1 or not I will not answer) but I did not learn and use last night.
 
I believe Wiz's claim, with only 1 doctor shot and 1 bodyguard shot it makes sense there is another protective role.

Now, wouldn't commuter be considered a protective role too? Would it be bypassed by a strong kill in a normal game?

.....
Protective roles:

1 doctor shot
1 bodyguard shot
X chainmail-giver shots
X(3? %commuter shots)*

Dunno, does this seems balanced to people?

I'm leaning towards yes, assuming scum has 1 or 2 strong kills

* A townie commuter can have negative utility if used when investigated by town
Commuter tends to be top of the stack in priority (really falling just behind “unmissable actions” like that one in Blarg’s skill actions (strengthen I believe it was)

I still think you role blocked me last night and something else went on to explain the one death
 

turmoil7

Imperial Corps Commander Who Cheers the Army
Malus mostly just rearranged his real role for his fakeclaim
True, Probably he didn't use a given fakeclaim to leave them for his partners, as there is no coming back from a red check no matter how good the fake claim, tho
 

Sorian

Neutral Ascetic 1-Shot BP SK Alignment Cop
Staff member
I believe Wiz's claim, with only 1 doctor shot and 1 bodyguard shot it makes sense there is another protective role.

Now, wouldn't commuter be considered a protective role too? Would it be bypassed by a strong kill in a normal game?

.....
Protective roles:

1 doctor shot
1 bodyguard shot
X chainmail-giver shots
X(3? %commuter shots)*

Dunno, does this seems balanced to people?

I'm leaning towards yes, assuming scum has 1 or 2 strong kills

* A townie commuter can have negative utility if used when investigated by town

I see it, honestly the commuter claim is the only outlier to me since it just sounds like that's all Ty can do and everyone else had protection in a more JOAT-like quality. Blarg not being allowed to be protected after becoming innocent child also points to more protection in balance since he would have pulled people's protection at no benefit.

-------

TWE I'm mostly ignoring you because usually whatever you are on makes no sense to me but I'm town reading you on meta so that's why I haven't really done much with you.
 

Ty4on

The 4 is silent
I guess we could try a trustfall while I sleep.

For those who don't know they're pretty easy, you just post something you townread from every player. Its purpose is to make you think about every player and help get out of tunnels.

I made mine without really reading back so many of them are quite shallow.

melonrabbit
Has a decent tone and has been curious about the game

nin1000
The timing of the shopkeeper convo claim was towny. Had info relevant to town and shared it. Doesn't feel like he has any agenda.

Sorian
Has made some decent reads that seem to come from trying to understand the game.

Franconp
Tracked turmoil. Has been active in solving the game.

Chuggernaut
Has a very towny approach to the game. Pretty much every read I see from them make me town read them harder. Seemed genuinely upset the fruit didn't make it ;_;

Alexem
Lie detector on chuggs. Their reads have decent progression.

turmoil7
Prematurely claimed targeting Zipped. Reads and actions lack a scum agenda. Good tone.

Zippedpinhead
Cop who nailed malus. Enough said.

Muffin
Gossip who had a nice chat with nin. Doesn't seem to approach the game from a scum perspective, rather a townie who's not meshing with some other players.

The Wizard
Has made some decent observations and reads.

TheWorthyEdge
Very good tone I think would be hard to fake.

Aeleus
Targeted Geno with a gossip whom I think was a good target. Sawneeks had a strong start to D2.

Geno
Has been consistent in their approach to the game. Aeleus seems certain they are town.

Natiko
Hasn't been farming XP like the flipped scum which is consistent with their low activity. Reads seem to come from a place of low certainty.
 

Ty4on

The 4 is silent
Found this old quote which helps explain trustfalls better than I could
trustfalls are a way of assessing the validity of each of your townreads, as well as a kind of reset - perhaps you're tunneling one person too much, in the trustfall you should set aside all of that and ask: why could i see this person as town?
 

Chuggernaut

HONK HONK MF
You know what, for competitive wagons sake:

VOTE: Geno

(Look at this asshole, he has a couple votes and he immediately tries to form a counter wagon, little do they know I'm actually trying to save Chuggs now)

Where are you looking if Geno flips scum? Build me a scum team from that
 

Chuggernaut

HONK HONK MF
Also just to be clear so no one is walking on eggshells here. I do not care if you scum read me or call my play bad or question my reads. that might annoy me sometimes, but it's the game and what I signed up for. What I did not sign up for was being insulted on a personal level. Don't do that. I will not do it to you
 

The Wizard

Confidently Incorrect
Thread looks kinda dead and Chuggs and turm wagons look lazy to me, I expected the malus flip to move things forward more.
Geno could be scum. He is hinting about a role that could prove him but if failed. Would be my second scum after Chuggs.
Fran can you give me your read on Geno outside of his supposed claim?
 

The Wizard

Confidently Incorrect
I don't mean to come off rude when I said lazy by the way. Poor choice of words, they just feel like the same lines people were thinking on despite the new info and I'm thinking we need more of a shakeup here.
 

The Wizard

Confidently Incorrect
Wiz where are you thinking. Give me your PoE. I know you floated Sorian but how much do you actually want that right now
Off the dome probably something like this:

town:
Zipped
melon
Ty
Chuggs
Ael
nin
TWE
Muffin

PoE:
Natiko
Fran
Alexem
Sorian
Geno

I would be happy to move the shopkeeper out of the PoE based on the way malus reacted at day start. I think Sorian is a good place to look and I'll probably move my vote there if things stay stagnant
 

Chuggernaut

HONK HONK MF
Off the dome probably something like this:

town:
Zipped
melon
Ty
Chuggs
Ael
nin
TWE
Muffin

PoE:
Natiko
Fran
Alexem
Sorian
Geno

I would be happy to move the shopkeeper out of the PoE based on the way malus reacted at day start. I think Sorian is a good place to look and I'll probably move my vote there if things stay stagnant

I really struggle to see Sorian as scum here. Like the play here for scum Sorian from my PoV was to come in here and keep tunneling me into the ground because there’s so many people stuck on that I really don’t see it reflecting badly on him specifically. I’m leaning toward Geno here still of everyone as boring as that feels
 

The Wizard

Confidently Incorrect
I really struggle to see Sorian as scum here. Like the play here for scum Sorian from my PoV was to come in here and keep tunneling me into the ground because there’s so many people stuck on that I really don’t see it reflecting badly on him specifically. I’m leaning toward Geno here still of everyone as boring as that feels
On the flip side if everyone else wants your head then Sorian doesn't really need to join that chorus?
Also this is flimsy but the way Geno was defending Fran earlier despite Fran having Geno as a top 2 scum read stood out to me. I will admit I am biased to distrust Fran after spilling my guts to him in a gossip chat in Mary Gary because I thought his posts looked good and I feel similar here to the point that I feel like I am less able to solve him.
 

Hedin

Oops, All Scum!
Staff member
==== DAY 4 VOTES ====
Day Start

Chuggernaut (3 votes)
Aeleus - #2,420
nin1000 - #2,519 #2,671
Franconp - #2,597
Natiko - #2,650 #2,669
Chuggernaut - #2,662

turmoil7 (3 votes)
TheWorthyEdge - #2,408
Zippedpinhead - #2,635
nin1000 - #2,671

Sorian (2 votes)
turmoil7 - #2,600
Ty4on - #2,603

Geno (2 votes)
The Wizard - #2,424
Sorian - #2,700

Ty4on (1 votes)
Geno - #2,391

Franconp (0 votes)
Chuggernaut - #2,548 #2,662

Not voting: Alexem, Natiko, Muffin, melonrabbit

Post Counts:
Chuggernaut: 74 TheWorthyEdge: 57 Franconp: 42 Geno: 38 melonrabbit: 30 Sorian: 28 The Wizard: 28 nin1000: 26 Ty4on: 25 Zippedpinhead: 25 turmoil7: 22 Aeleus: 19 Muffin: 17 Alexem: 13 Natiko: 7

Current Countdown:
oxl6c09om3



Click here to go to the Vote Tool!
 

Sorian

Neutral Ascetic 1-Shot BP SK Alignment Cop
Staff member
Where are you looking if Geno flips scum? Build me a scum team from that

It's kind of crazy but if Geno is scum, I think this whole Ty thing has been a distancing play. I know Geno is very gamerunner brained but I find it to be such a weird thing to stick on that even after there is no mention of exp sharing in the scum role PM, he immediately jumped to saying it would probably be a post in the scum chat. It's not even a crazy theory but this has gone beyond a regular tunnel at this point and it reminds me of something I did once where I just sat on Coppa for days when I was scum with him just for the cred when he finally died (he did not die that game). Past that though, Geno hasn't really made a lot of connections so him flipping scum would be great but I don't see a lot of leads off of him.

Also for the record two people have claimed two of my abilities.

There has been a claim of one of my abilities (and I think maybe 2? someone was a little vague and I have no reason to probe it currently) that's kind of why I'm having a hard time getting mad at double claims in this game, they are literally all over the place when most of the roster seems to be JOATs.
 

Sorian

Neutral Ascetic 1-Shot BP SK Alignment Cop
Staff member
What am I confirming?

If I remember right, he's the one who said he sent you a vest or shield or something but he's under the impression that you would not be notified, he wanted confirmation on if you knew or not.
 

Sorian

Neutral Ascetic 1-Shot BP SK Alignment Cop
Staff member
I really struggle to see Sorian as scum here. Like the play here for scum Sorian from my PoV was to come in here and keep tunneling me into the ground because there’s so many people stuck on that I really don’t see it reflecting badly on him specifically. I’m leaning toward Geno here still of everyone as boring as that feels

On the flip side if everyone else wants your head then Sorian doesn't really need to join that chorus?
Also this is flimsy but the way Geno was defending Fran earlier despite Fran having Geno as a top 2 scum read stood out to me. I will admit I am biased to distrust Fran after spilling my guts to him in a gossip chat in Mary Gary because I thought his posts looked good and I feel similar here to the point that I feel like I am less able to solve him.

Also, I'll let you two hash me out but I feel like it's worth mentioning that I am now in the camp of actively defending Chuggs and I don't think everyone else even wants his head. Me putting weight elsewhere kind of does make his lynch less likely at this stage.
 

turmoil7

Imperial Corps Commander Who Cheers the Army
Not gonna lie, I am worried chuggs is scum with Sorian with how much they support each other :thisisfine:

Although I don't think it's the most likely case

unvote
 

turmoil7

Imperial Corps Commander Who Cheers the Army
Geno's questioning during this day phase seemed to me as an attempt to fan the flames more than a genuine attempt at understanding the game state.

vote: Geno
 

Franconp

Frank
Fran can you give me your read on Geno outside of his supposed claim?

I have him as scum. As I said before Geno being so fixed on Ty could be stubborn town!Geno or scum!Geno just fixing on something and not participating. After Malus flip I'm leaning more on scum!Geno. As Sorian said he is moving the goalposts: I asked D1 if he was going to keep tunnelling or move on D2 and he said that he would stay in Ty unless we have more info. Now we know that scum didn't have a sharing mechanic in their PM and now he claims it would be in the first post of the scum chat. This doesn't feel like stubborn Geno but more like him being worried of playing the game.

He also had this read D2 about Neon's wagon:

From the people on the Neon vote I don't like nin and I'm not sure about malus either, voted there purely for XP and hasn't really played much. I need to read Captain and Chuggs again to see if I agree with others who scum read them

Which kinda feels like a bus. Bringing only Malus as scummy for going after XP is weird when Blarg and Zipped also voted there for the xp. Why one but not the other 2? That doesn't feel like a consistent read and feels like a bus on a partner to distance themselves.

Malus read on Geno also looks scummy:

I give Geno one more day of tunneling Ty, before seriously considering that wagon.

I already said D3 that Malus comment about Geno felt like scum throwing a little shade but not really:

And the comment of Geno kinda sus.
 

nin1000

Chilean German Madman
From the people on the Neon vote I don't like nin and I'm not sure about malus either, voted there purely for XP and hasn't really played much. I need to read Captain and Chuggs again to see if I agree with others who scum read them

Can you elaborate on why you dont ?
 

nin1000

Chilean German Madman
I already said D3 that Malus comment about Geno felt like scum throwing a little shade but not really:

You know what Fran, i accept you apology and will do what you're apparently too afraid to do.
As in you're throwing in shade but actually not putting a vote down.

I will vote for your scum buddy then

Vote: Geno
 

Alexem

Yeah, I'm town
That's been a lot to catch up on. (Had a very nice calamari followed by tavuk shish at the work do last night, but it pretty much put me in a food coma long before we left the place.)

For reasons I've gone over, I'm not liking those Chuggs votes. I'm inclined to think the Chuggs vs Fran situation was town against town that spilled out of hand, which could have provided the ideal cover for scum to push a train. If Chuggs gets booted and flips green, I'll be giving his voters some serious side-eye. (For what it's worth, I'm still fairly positive on Fran - I see where he's coming from on Chuggs, but I think these are misgivings being taken too far.)

I can see the arguments from Zipped about Turmoil, but I'd be cautious about booting someone with claimed defensive abilities without some evidence. I can get that the bodyguard option would have been a risky option while Turmoil still had the healer shot in his pocket, although I still wonder why Blarg wasn't the more pressing target. Still, without seeing the full command PM from Hedin and only knowing what Neon's flip said, I'll have to take it on trust that poison protection wasn't mentioned - if that's the case, then Zipped would have been a logical choice of patient under the circumstances.

I'm not sure what to make of Geno at the moment. Aeleus is certainly willing to vouch for him, in spite of their misgivings about Geno accepting their town alignment very quickly and his willingness to use his power for survival. Still, Aeleus does apparently know a way to validate Geno's claim, so given that I feel positive about Aeleus, I'm willing to hear them out if Geno wants to go through with that proof. His pushing for Ty does certainly sound like it's coming from a townie being stuck in a tunnel. Without knowing more, I have a feeling that Geno could potentially be used as a target for a mis-hit, so I don't think I'd be comfortable on that train.

On the subject of tunnels, Wiz asked me this:
What info did you get from Ty to make you feel better?
It started with Ty claiming the commuter power at the end of D1. Again, it's a tough one to prove, but I could take that as an attempt to goad scum into wasting a shot if I put my crazy theories hat on. I also appreciate that he's made some more insightful posts over the last couple of days, even if I've not agreed with everything he's said. Honestly, I was grasping at straws on D1, so with more real information to work on, I'm more willing to accept that all the talk about potential partnerships was paranoia talking.

The Sorian train could go either way for me. As much as he's been talking down his strengths, I still think he's a good player to have around if he's town. I think he might be jumping the gun on the Geno train - I could see that as a defensive vote, perhaps, but I don't think he was under immediate threat from Ty and Turms' votes. I'll accept that his votes haven't been great so far, but I'd still like to see a smoking gun than go with the 'he's too good at Mafia' thinking that often comes up when he's around. I've not really got the impression that he's been pushing for a mis-hit against Turmoil, but I could have overlooked that.

For players that I haven't mentioned - I'm still reserving judgement on Muffin until we know more about what's going on with these night chats. I agree that there could be a bad gossip, but we're still building up information on those. Wizard's been OK - I think the fact that he's been one of the players more willing to question my thinking directly is a small plus in his favour, but I can also see him as sticking on the fringes. Will take the chainmail (some kind of BP giver shot, I assume?) claim for now, although Melon does seem to be a slightly odd choice of candidate - were they really at immediate risk from scum after Zipped had delivered a red check, and if their hints at being a hider (around post 2124) are correct, couldn't Melon have taken care of themselves? Worthy is also someone that's made good points but feels as if they're trying not to stand out too much - however, I have a hunch about Worthy (albeit little more than a gut feeling) that makes me feel as though he's pro-town, so I wouldn't want to vote there.

That leaves Melon and Natiko. Melon made a good first impression on me with their activity and I felt a good attempt to solve. However, they've felt a bit more 'in the background' in the last few days, and I've got the feeling that they may be giving the impression of having skills like hiding and learning without actively backing them up. Natiko, meanwhile, has been a 'here and there' poster to me, the sort of activity that I'd usually associate with flying low. Again, that's a gut feeling, though, so it's hard to make into a firm accusation. Both have had bad takes on Chuggs, I feel, and as he's one of my stronger town reads, I have to wonder if they've been pushing for a mis-hit there.

With all that in mind, I feel like I'm at a toss-up between Melon and Nat, so right now I'll back up Worthy on this one.

VOTE: melonrabbit
 

Alexem

Yeah, I'm town
Ah, I went though all that and forgot about Nin. Nin seems OK to me, although I'd be lying if I still didn't have one or two reservations about the Neon vote. Still, I've liked Nin's activity more in the last couple of days. He's another of those players where I've not agreed with everything he's said, but I've not exactly felt any reasons to see him coming from a bad place.
 

Alexem

Yeah, I'm town
And Zipped as well! Told you I'm no good with larger games. Can't look too harshly on someone who delivered a red check - I can't see any sense in scum!Zipped bussing Malus at that point, so I think that was a legit move. I can see the logic in what he's saying about Turmoil being a possible roleblocker, but that strikes me more as a WIFOM take.
 

Franconp

Frank
You know what Fran, i accept you apology and will do what you're apparently too afraid to do.
As in you're throwing in shade but actually not putting a vote down.

I will vote for your scum buddy then

Vote: Geno

Nin, I literally said that I think Geno is scum. That is no shade. That's a hard read.

Seems like I'm the only one that thinks that Chuggs is scum. I don't know why because he hasn't done anything even remotely townie all game.

Whatever,

Vote: Geno
 

Alexem

Yeah, I'm town
alex how do you feel about Geno being scum ?
The potential's there. I'm not going to argue against the Geno vote, but Aeleus's vote of confidence isn't a bad look for Geno and, having been in a crazy tunnel myself, I can see him being stuck in one now.

That said, if Geno does have a way to prove himself as Aeleus believes, I think he's going to have to come up with the goods soon.
 

Hedin

Oops, All Scum!
Staff member
==== DAY 4 VOTES ====
Day Start

Geno (5 votes)
The Wizard - #2,424
Sorian - #2,700
turmoil7 - #2,755
nin1000 - #2,759
Franconp - #2,765

Chuggernaut (2 votes)
Aeleus - #2,420
nin1000 - #2,519 #2,671
Franconp - #2,597 #2,765
Natiko - #2,650 #2,669
Chuggernaut - #2,662

melonrabbit (2 votes)
TheWorthyEdge - #2,750
Alexem - #2,760

Ty4on (1 votes)
Geno - #2,391

Sorian (1 votes)
turmoil7 - #2,600 #2,754
Ty4on - #2,603

turmoil7 (1 votes)
TheWorthyEdge - #2,408 #2,750
Zippedpinhead - #2,635
nin1000 - #2,671 #2,759

Franconp (0 votes)
Chuggernaut - #2,548 #2,662

Not voting: Natiko, Muffin, melonrabbit

Post Counts:
Chuggernaut: 74 TheWorthyEdge: 59 Franconp: 44 Geno: 38 nin1000: 32 Sorian: 31 melonrabbit: 30 The Wizard: 28 Ty4on: 25 Zippedpinhead: 25 turmoil7: 24 Aeleus: 19 Muffin: 18 Alexem: 17 Natiko: 7

Current Countdown:
oxl6c09om3



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Sorian

Neutral Ascetic 1-Shot BP SK Alignment Cop
Staff member
Nin, I literally said that I think Geno is scum. That is no shade. That's a hard read.

Seems like I'm the only one that thinks that Chuggs is scum. I don't know why because he hasn't done anything even remotely townie all game.

Whatever,

Vote: Geno
The issue with Chuggs is the mechanics, I agree that his play has been bad but I don’t see how his claim happens when it does with a now confirmed ability that seems to have done exactly what he said. It makes no sense to me.
 

Franconp

Frank
The issue with Chuggs is the mechanics, I agree that his play has been bad but I don’t see how his claim happens when it does with a now confirmed ability that seems to have done exactly what he said. It makes no sense to me.

But the only instance that we can confirm of his ability has negativity utility. The action that he claimed that could help town just didn't worked. Why can't it be a scum role?

The first shot missed, the second shot is bad and we need to wait 2 more days before he can use his T3.

@Chuggernaut why use T2 last night instead of waiting one more day and use a T3 instead? You use a negative ability when you can wait one more day and help town. You are more likely to hit town than hit scum. So, why not wait?
 
The potential's there. I'm not going to argue against the Geno vote, but Aeleus's vote of confidence isn't a bad look for Geno and, having been in a crazy tunnel myself, I can see him being stuck in one now.

That said, if Geno does have a way to prove himself as Aeleus believes, I think he's going to have to come up with the goods soon.
I'm really not sure how it came across that I gave Geno a vote of confidence so I'm going to expand on some things.

Geno claimed to use an action on me that I would be able to verify (he told me the power but I won't share that info) but stated there was a 50% chance it would be delayed by a day. I didn't see anything but even if I did I would not consider it a green check by any means.

Overall my feelings on Geno improved but not to the point that he's out of my POE. Both in posts and role there was some stuff I liked, some stuff I didn't like.

Additionally I have a slightly mad theory where Geno and Chuggs are unlikely to both be scum but:
a) that theory is slightly impacted by Geno's role claim so I can't share it
b) even if I did I believe basically everyone else would disregard it
 
People town reading nin is driving me mad, there's too many for it to be scum partners protecting each other but I truly do not see it at all.
 

Sorian

Neutral Ascetic 1-Shot BP SK Alignment Cop
Staff member
But the only instance that we can confirm of his ability has negativity utility. The action that he claimed that could help town just didn't worked. Why can't it be a scum role?

The first shot missed, the second shot is bad and we need to wait 2 more days before he can use his T3.

@Chuggernaut why use T2 last night instead of waiting one more day and use a T3 instead? You use a negative ability when you can wait one more day and help town. You are more likely to hit town than hit scum. So, why not wait?
And we only know about the failed T1 because he told us. We literally would not have that information unless he brought it up. He clearly thought TWE was going to confirm something. I’ve gone through it and I don’t see why scum bothers with this, he had literally no reason.
 
Why are people so hot to call Melon Town?
My initial read was Melon was posting from the hip without worrying how people would react to it which I liked.

(ignore the fact that I disliked Capn for posting from the hip and worrying how people reacted and he flipped town)
 
Found this old quote which helps explain trustfalls better than I could
I will attempt to do a trustfall before the end of the day as I feel bad that everyone else ignored it but keep in mind way too many of my reads are 'vibe' based.
 

Alexem

Yeah, I'm town
I'm really not sure how it came across that I gave Geno a vote of confidence so I'm going to expand on some things.
Fair enough - if your report on the chat sounded more optimistic to me than it was intended, then I don't want to put words in your mouth. From the sounds of things, I think we'll need to see what Geno's got up his sleeve and make up our minds from there.

If it is the case that we'll have to wait a day to see this proof, do you feel that there's going to be any risk to town from Geno in that time delay, or should waiting be a safe option?
 

Franconp

Frank
People town reading nin is driving me mad, there's too many for it to be scum partners protecting each other but I truly do not see it at all.

To me it's based on what the shopkeeper told me mostly. He confirmed to me that Nin was invited N1 and he didn't posted. Nin claiming that he just forgot makes me think that:

- He doesn't have an extra chat to check the site during the night.
- If he where part of a scum team they would have reminded him to check the chat.

But that is just my point of view because I trust that the shopkeeper didn't lied to me.

Besides that Nin claimed Mayor. The double vote is whatever (scum had double votes before) but a Mayor is too strong to be scum I think. If Nin use his mayor power he is pretty much cleared for me so time will solve that.

And we only know about the failed T1 because he told us. We literally would not have that information unless he brought it up. He clearly thought TWE was going to confirm something. I’ve gone through it and I don’t see why scum bothers with this, he had literally no reason.

And that's exactly why it bothers me. Chuggs all game has been "scum wouldn't do that". But that is not exactly true when you are selfconcious about how your actions.
 
You can vote me out, that's fine, but even if you believe Ty is town, scum won't kill him, and you can't let him for mylo.
 

nin1000

Chilean German Madman
Nin, I literally said that I think Geno is scum. That is no shade. That's a hard read.

Seems like I'm the only one that thinks that Chuggs is scum. I don't know why because he hasn't done anything even remotely townie all game.

Whatever,

Vote: Geno

I also think he is scum, we are in unity.
Can we agree on doing it Geno -> chuggs then ?
 
Fair enough - if your report on the chat sounded more optimistic to me than it was intended, then I don't want to put words in your mouth. From the sounds of things, I think we'll need to see what Geno's got up his sleeve and make up our minds from there.

If it is the case that we'll have to wait a day to see this proof, do you feel that there's going to be any risk to town from Geno in that time delay, or should waiting be a safe option?
You aren't the only one left with that impression so the fault is on me.

I don't think town will be at risk, the claimed power isn't anti-town and if geno was trying to buy time to use a strong scum power I'd have thought he'd have voted on a leading train to get XP. But again the 'proof' won't solve geno's spot.

Besides that Nin claimed Mayor. The double vote is whatever (scum had double votes before) but a Mayor is too strong to be scum I think. If Nin use his mayor power he is pretty much cleared for me so time will solve that.
I completely forgot mayor didn't just mean the double vote, fair enough.
 

nin1000

Chilean German Madman
People town reading nin is driving me mad, there's too many for it to be scum partners protecting each other but I truly do not see it at all.
You don’t seem to think that I am town ? Or have I read that wrong.
Being against the mayor is one thing, saying the mayor is scum is harsh
 

Franconp

Frank
I completely forgot mayor didn't just mean the double vote, fair enough.

Ok, I went back to check and Nin says that he is the mayor but then he said this:

I jokingly replied to blarg, who was fishing for my T3 Ability that the most annoying player would be killed. I have not and will not reveal my T3 to anyone.

So, not really sure if he is really a mayor or not. But for his T1 he claimed beloved and Malus had is similar to what Malus had as T2. I don't believe that scum had 2 of them. I still think that Nin is town.
 
Nin said he just is beloved no? No T1, just passively
Ok, I went back to check and Nin says that he is the mayor but then he said this:



So, not really sure if he is really a mayor or not. But for his T1 he claimed beloved and Malus had is similar to what Malus had as T2. I don't believe that scum had 2 of them. I still think that Nin is town.
 

Chuggernaut

HONK HONK MF
And that's exactly why it bothers me. Chuggs all game has been "scum wouldn't do that". But that is not exactly true when you are selfconcious about how your actions.

Except literally no one is using this argument except for Sorian. I get the whole “WIFOM must be bad” logic thinking but at some point you need to ask yourself if something truly makes sense as a scum play.

As for your tier 3 question I legit thought I was dying today. If you had an issue with me using a tier 2 you should have brought that up when I mentioned it last phase
 

Chuggernaut

HONK HONK MF
That’s just a pity vote from you.

you can do better and hopefully will do better tomorrow dear chuggs. Now snap out of it

tbc the only reason I haven’t switched my vote is I just don’t want the Geno wagon to run away with it. I’m not leaving it there.

but also if you think I’m scum vote for me
 

Sorian

Neutral Ascetic 1-Shot BP SK Alignment Cop
Staff member
I feel like I'm already talking myself out of this, this feels so easy and even Geno is laying down but then I see this post:

You can vote me out, that's fine, but even if you believe Ty is town, scum won't kill him, and you can't let him for mylo.

And that's a really good post for scum Geno to make about scum Ty. But like, now I'm wondering if Muffin is the choice. I still think there is one between Muffin and Geno and Muffin just dips every time he isn't up for consideration. I feel like my list of suspects is too small for there still to be, what 4 scum members left?
 
Ael can you confirm that you're not gonna die if I get lynched? If you're gonna die then I'm gonna claim, if not then I'm not going to.
 

Chuggernaut

HONK HONK MF
I feel like I'm already talking myself out of this, this feels so easy and even Geno is laying down but then I see this post:



And that's a really good post for scum Geno to make about scum Ty. But like, now I'm wondering if Muffin is the choice. I still think there is one between Muffin and Geno and Muffin just dips every time he isn't up for consideration. I feel like my list of suspects is too small for there still to be, what 4 scum members left?

Yeah this is the thing that I'm worried about. I still think there's a decent chance it's Geno and I'm wondering if how the day went just kind of killed scums enthusiasm too, but I feel like there's not enough people in my PoE here which makes me think we have a deepwolf somewhere.

I still don't really think it's Muffin. I don't think Malus cared if he died day 2
 

melonrabbit

The only good kind of melon
My initial read was Melon was posting from the hip without worrying how people would react to it which I liked.

(ignore the fact that I disliked Capn for posting from the hip and worrying how people reacted and he flipped town)

And I still do not care.
 
Ael can you confirm that you're not gonna die if I get lynched? If you're gonna die then I'm gonna claim, if not then I'm not going to.
I won't die, is there any reason not to claim?

What does your team look like?
Since I know it includes me, what would your team look like if I flipped town right now?
Geno's scum team was you, turmoil, nin and then either melon or wizard at the time of our night chat.
 

Alexem

Yeah, I'm town
If I was to rate the chatters right now, I'd go Aeleus > Shopkeeper > Muffin, but that may be because the Muffin chats are the ones we know the least about. The other two have some gimmicks to them at least, so are we looking at a situation where scum might have a 'vanilla' gossip compared to town (potentially including a neutral if the shopkeeper's a 'safe' neutral) having chats with features?
 

Sorian

Neutral Ascetic 1-Shot BP SK Alignment Cop
Staff member
If I was to rate the chatters right now, I'd go Aeleus > Shopkeeper > Muffin, but that may be because the Muffin chats are the ones we know the least about. The other two have some gimmicks to them at least, so are we looking at a situation where scum might have a 'vanilla' gossip compared to town (potentially including a neutral if the shopkeeper's a 'safe' neutral) having chats with features?
I think part of the issue is that Wizard is right. We are calling them all gossips but Aeleus is a lover not a gossip, the shopkeeper isn't a gossip at all, and it's really just Muffin claiming full on non-JOAT gossip. I'm still skeptical about it personally because it feels like a lot but him saying he's just a gossip and that's all is making me hold my tongue. Also, I know you said chatters and not gossips but I think the general sentiment has been linking them all together as kind of the same role which isn't true.
 

Franconp

Frank
I think part of the issue is that Wizard is right. We are calling them all gossips but Aeleus is a lover not a gossip, the shopkeeper isn't a gossip at all, and it's really just Muffin claiming full on non-JOAT gossip. I'm still skeptical about it personally because it feels like a lot but him saying he's just a gossip and that's all is making me hold my tongue. Also, I know you said chatters and not gossips but I think the general sentiment has been linking them all together as kind of the same role which isn't true.

Didn't Ael claimed that all their abilities are chats with different modifiers? I'm on mobile and can't check.
 
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